I got to thinking about..............

[cpm9ball]

Yeah, I know it's rare!

 

.............the comment James made about the buyer who talked him down to $1700 on a coin only to come back 10 minutes later bragging that he just made $50 flipping it.

 

Like I said in the post about dealer/customer relationships at shows, I don't buy coins only to turn around and sell them for a profit. I buy them for myself.

 

Has anyone ever considered going back to a dealer who had just sold him a coin and splitting the profit with him? I know this is totally out of character for most people, but think about what it might do for you in the future. Do you think the dealer would be apt to remember you more readily? How thankful do you think he would be? Do you think he would be more apt to show you his little cache of gems?

 

What are your thoughts?

[WoodenJefferson]

I say the dealer is going to remember you as a rat!

 

Much may depend on the amount of money that is raised in a flip, like an offer you can’t refuse and then going back to the dealer to tell him of the fortunate deal you just made and offering him a finders fee or percentage, but for the most part I have a feeling there is going to be lots of suspicion on any other future transactions with him.

 

Now if a deal is made in advance, then all gloves are off…but then you’d become his broker of sorts, hawking coins on the side that he would not normally be able do during a show. It would be a win-win situation for the dealer, he’s already gotten paid for the coin and turned you loose on the bourse floor to find someone who will pay even more while he sits back and awaits the percentage.

 

[jesbroken]

Much may depend on the amount of money that is raised in a flip, like an offer you can’t refuse and then going back to the dealer to tell him of the fortunate deal you just made and offering him a finders fee or percentage, but for the most part I have a feeling there is going to be lots of suspicion on any other future transactions with him.

 

Woody

I think any dealer that would become upset or suspicious with anyone whom they sold a coin to, that returned after the flip and offered to pay him a bonus/premium/finder's fee because the buyer sold it, would be unworthy of this consideration. My goodness, do all dealers think that their sales are final and not to be resold? If so, I have fallen to the wayside, as I was taught when you purchase something at fair market value(no strings attached pre-sale) then it is yours to do with as you see fit. I cannot believe that very many sellers feel they should control the destiny of the sale. Come on, sellers, own up:

 

Do you think that a sale that a seller makes to a buyer at fair market value(with no presale agreements) should not be resold?

 

Jim

[World Colonial]

The answer to your question is "No, of course not". But a better question to that hypothetical example might be, So what? Is a $50 profit on a $1700 coin something worth bragging about? Granted it might have only required 10 minutes of their time but its still only 3%.

[michael]

pound me down on the price then come back soon after and brag to me you made 50 dollars flipping it??

 

well looks like next time my good/special new coins will not ever

be offered to you

 

also anything in my case you see is all net priced what i quote you at

which will be 50 more than the list price to begin with pass or play

[cpm9ball]

Okay, so let's not dwell on the specifics of James' transaction. Like I said, it just made me think about the basic scenario.

 

By the way, I think this is another of those situations where there is no right or wrong answer.

 

Chris

[jesbroken]

Chris,

Lets be sure we realize two different issues are being discussed here-1) for a buyer to be so flippant as to sell a just bought item and brag about the $50 profit to the original seller is assinine and I believe all agree the buyer was a "brown thing on the sidewalk" to do so.

2) A buyer that buys a coin with no presale limitations and comes back to the seller after flipping it with an offer of rebate/commission/whatever should be considered a very valuable customer that would always be welcome at my table.

No doubt as to #1-creep

but #2 good customer. IMHO

Jim

[just-john]

I think this is a rare example or not very common compared to the number of times dealers talking to dealer brag about their sales. What would be interesting would be to over hear a dealer bragging about a customers purchase to another dealer and having the customer and brag about selling it at a profit of $50.00 then notice the other dealer and saying sorry I didn't see you their ,now that would be something .

I feel once you sell it's no longer your concern- over done with-end of story

[Dcoin]

Chris, the idea is interesting, but most people do not have the level of trust needed to complete the transaction.

 

The closest I get to this scenario is a dealer who looks at all my purchases before I leave the local show. She looks through, gives me opinions/thoughts, and sometimes offers to buy.

 

 

 

[CHABSENTIA]

Chris, the idea is interesting, but most people do not have the level of trust needed to complete the transaction.

 

The closest I get to this scenario is a dealer who looks at all my purchases before I leave the local show. She looks through, gives me opinions/thoughts, and sometimes offers to buy.

 

 

 

Maybe the Buyer in this case just wanted attention and had some sort of Insecurity problem and just wanted to feed an ego or lack of one.

[cpm9ball]

I think some of you are missing the whole point of this discussion. Try to forget about James' situation, and direct your responses only to the questions where I have started the paragraph with.......... Has anyone ever......

 

Chris

[Dcoin]

Chris, the idea is interesting, but most people do not have the level of trust needed to complete the transaction.

 

The closest I get to this scenario is a dealer who looks at all my purchases before I leave the local show. She looks through, gives me opinions/thoughts, and sometimes offers to buy.

 

 

 

Maybe the Buyer in this case just wanted attention and had some sort of Insecurity problem and just wanted to feed an ego or lack of one.

 

Chabsentia, the relationship is symbiotic. I like/trust her opinion and she gets first look at coins that she might have missed on the floor.

 

Point is I trust her enough, that there will be some benefit given in return. In order for Chris's scenario to work there would have to be that level of trust between the two parties.

 

[Larry Dreher]

My story is somewhat related....

 

I stopped at a dealer's booth where the dealer had stepped away. There was another guy standing there looking at the coins in the glass case. I told him I was looking at the panda coins and had my eye on the 1982 1/2 ounce gold panda. The guy asked me how much I thought it was worth. At the time spot was right around $1000, and I told him I thought the coin was worth maybe $800. 1982 is the first year of panda coins and they sell for a premium over spot.

 

His jaw opened and he looked stunned. He had just earlier sold that same coin to the dealer for spot not knowing any better. The dealer came back and the other guy was pretty upset with the situation. Knowing that the dealer had just paid spot for the coin moments earlier, I offered him $700 for the coin (which he accepted) and gave the guy who sold it $50. My cost was under the retail price and the original seller was genuinely happy to get the cash.

 

[cpm9ball]

My story is somewhat related....

 

I stopped at a dealer's booth where the dealer had stepped away. There was another guy standing there looking at the coins in the glass case. I told him I was looking at the panda coins and had my eye on the 1982 1/2 ounce gold panda. The guy asked me how much I thought it was worth. At the time spot was right around $1000, and I told him I thought the coin was worth maybe $800. 1982 is the first year of panda coins and they sell for a premium over spot.

 

His jaw opened and he looked stunned. He had just earlier sold that same coin to the dealer for spot not knowing any better. The dealer came back and the other guy was pretty upset with the situation. Knowing that the dealer had just paid spot for the coin moments earlier, I offered him $700 for the coin (which he accepted) and gave the guy who sold it $50. My cost was under the retail price and the original seller was genuinely happy to get the cash.

 

So, the original seller went away with $550 and the dealer made $150 on his $500 outlay. Correct? That seems fair to me, and the dealer should be given a little pat on the back because he really didn't have to forgo the extra $50. Unless.........

 

If you can recall, was the original seller making a scene that could have reflected badly on the dealer's ability to conduct further business at the show?

 

Chris

[just-john]

My answer would be know since no dealer as ever offered to cover any of my losses

and I would guess there are more people who have loss than gain's

[MarkFeld]

My story is somewhat related....

 

I stopped at a dealer's booth where the dealer had stepped away. There was another guy standing there looking at the coins in the glass case. I told him I was looking at the panda coins and had my eye on the 1982 1/2 ounce gold panda. The guy asked me how much I thought it was worth. At the time spot was right around $1000, and I told him I thought the coin was worth maybe $800. 1982 is the first year of panda coins and they sell for a premium over spot.

 

His jaw opened and he looked stunned. He had just earlier sold that same coin to the dealer for spot not knowing any better. The dealer came back and the other guy was pretty upset with the situation. Knowing that the dealer had just paid spot for the coin moments earlier, I offered him $700 for the coin (which he accepted) and gave the guy who sold it $50. My cost was under the retail price and the original seller was genuinely happy to get the cash.

 

So, the original seller went away with $550 and the dealer made $150 on his $500 outlay. Correct? That seems fair to me, and the dealer should be given a little pat on the back because he really didn't have to forgo the extra $50. Unless.........

 

If you can recall, was the original seller making a scene that could have reflected badly on the dealer's ability to conduct further business at the show?

 

Chris

That doesn't seem fair to me. It sounds as if the dealer paid $500 and sold for $700, for a 40% profit. A dealer's buy-sell spread on that type of item should be a lot less than 40%.

 

If I read it correctly, the additional $50 that the original seller received was from (the generous) Larry, not the dealer, who deserves something other than a pat on the back - perhaps a kick in the rear?

[Larry Dreher]

was the original seller making a scene

 

No, I wouldn't call it a scene but he clearly wasn't happy. In the end I think we all left feeling ok.

 

On a side note, the coin in question graded 69 which is pretty high for the 1982's. I ended up with a nice coin in my collection at a reasonable price.

[Larry Dreher]

If I read it correctly, the additional $50 that the original seller received was from (the generous) Larry, not the dealer, who deserves something other than a pat on the back - perhaps a kick in the rear?

 

I'm going to give the dealer the benefit of the doubt that he didn't know the true retail value of the 1982 panda. Many (most) dates sell for very little premium over spot. This dealer was clearly not a Panda expert. He had a wide variety of stuff he was selling. I'm guessing he knew there was a premium just not exactly how much with further research.

 

For instance... A 1998 1/10 Ounce Gold Panda retails for $450. The 1997 & 1999 just a few dollars over spot.

[MarkFeld]

If I read it correctly, the additional $50 that the original seller received was from (the generous) Larry, not the dealer, who deserves something other than a pat on the back - perhaps a kick in the rear?

 

I'm going to give the dealer the benefit of the doubt that he didn't know the true retail value of the 1982 panda. Many (most) dates sell for very little premium over spot. This dealer was clearly not a Panda expert. He had a wide variety of stuff he was selling. I'm guessing he knew there was a premium just not exactly how much with further research.

 

For instance... A 1998 1/10 Ounce Gold Panda retails for $450. The 1997 & 1999 just a few dollars over spot.

Well, based on that, you sound even more generous to have offered that much of a premium/profit to the dealer. (thumbs u

[123cents]

That was very generous of you Larry. I commend your actions.