Textile Toned?

[MunkyMan95]

I got this coin a while ago in a trade, and sent it back to the previous owner so he could have it graded for me. The coin is very pink with different shades of blue in hand, but these scans are a little dark. You think the obverse is a little textile toned? Also, what do you think it would grade at NGC? Thanks!

 

 

 

PS: The scans were also taken through the plastic flip I mailed them in as to not get fingerprints on the coin, so judge the pictures with a grain of salt.

[Bruceswar]

MS63 shot 64 if the luster is there. I don't see any textile toming on the coin.

[MunkyMan95]

The coin in hand is pink in most of the center of the coin, and on the edges there is some electric blue toning. Really you think MS63-64? The luster isn't incredibly bad, but it's not brilliant either. Maybe this will help you better picture the toning...

 

 

And here's where I saw textile the most from the scans.

 

[Bruceswar]

What are your thoughts on the coin? I think what your are seeing is a finger print. Also looks like to have some minor read marks to the northwest of that on the coin.

[Bruceswar]

Unless the coin has wear in the hair which is a bit hard to discern in the pictures, then I will stand by MS63 shot 64

[XpipedreamR]

Seems more like tactile toning than textile toning

[WinstonWare]

Chad, It's hard for me to tell from these scans. You would probably have a better guess than anyone after having the coin in hand.

 

Here is a brilliant example of textile toning (not mine unfortunately)

 

Also Shane has a couple in his Morgan dollar sale

Shane's sale

 

From those examples maybe you can get a better assesment if there is textile toning there.

[WaxonWaxov]

so textile toning..... is this caused by the coin being in contact with some sort of fabric over a long period of time hence the term, "textile"?

[Brotherman]

so textile toning..... is this caused by the coin being in contact with some sort of fabric over a long period of time hence the term, "textile"?

 

Yes, but all bagged toned Morgans tone because of the fabric (mint bag). Textile toning usually means you can see the weave of the fabric in the toning.

 

Hays

[TJ'S Coins]

Chad there is textile toning on the obverse of this Morgan. It is a nice feature that adds to the character of the coin and provides a visual clue as to how it spent many of its years since being minted. I like it!

[MunkyMan95]

I was worried about this coin for some odd reason... The ear is all there Bruce, hair pronounced. Here's some replies I got on tradingslabs:

 

"AU obverse, reverse may be UNC, hard to tell from photos."

 

"AU55, but as I recall AU requires some original mint lustre and I can't see any of that from the photo."

 

"No mint luster so I would say cleaned at one time and retoned

Maybe a little flat over the ear and at bottom curls eagles breast looks rubbed or flat

Really can't tell from the pic

maybe AU but it look like it was dipped

IMHO"

 

You guys think cleaned? I sure hope not, it really is a great coin in hand.

[TomB]

Your image makes the coin appear to have negative eye appeal and I see absolutely no evidence of textile toning.

[MunkyMan95]

Well, now you all can understand how poor quality my photos will be for Bruce's contest

[TomB]

This may be a lame question, but what is the mint of the coin? I can't tell if it's an 1878 or an 1878-S. I will assume an 1878-S because there appears to be something in that position on my monitor.

 

Now, I have a question for you and I do not mean to be a jerk by it, but I am curious. Why would you slab this coin? If the coin is substantially nicer in-hand, with very attractive toning, you could justify sending it in if you believe it's an MS63 or higher. However, the scans aren't conveying anything like that at all to me.

 

I realize I know nothing of the transaction for this piece, but if you are paying shipping to mail the coin to someone ($5) and they are sending it to NGC by Registered Mail ($9) followed by NGC slabbing the coin ($15) and then shipping it back to you ($9) it would seem to me you are into the piece for at least $38 for shipping and slabbing. Of course, if this person is shipping the coin with other pieces then you may not have to pay for the trip to NGC and might only have to pay for the return trip from this person to you. In that case you would have only an additional $25 or so into the coin. You may even have a coupon for free grading on this coin, which would reduce your expenses to about $10.

 

Even if you are only paying $10 to have the coin slabbed I still wonder why you would do it since you seemed genuinely surprised by Bruce's guesstimate of MS63 or MS64 and you had other responses from somewhere else that seemed to all be AU. This makes me think that you believe the coin has a real chance to go AU. Given that chance, the extra $10 would be a fairly large chunk of the coin's value.

 

Again, I'm not trying to be a jerk, I just don't follow the logic of the piece and I also realize that I am in the dark as to the transaction.

[MunkyMan95]

Well, I wanted to go through the grading process myself and see how it's all done at NGC. I mailed the coin just regular old mail, straight from my mailbox. 2 stamps there. He's using one of his free submissions on me here, and he's mailing his coins with my coin. So basically, it cost me the price of two stamps, a small pirce of bubble wrap, and an envelope.

 

And yes, this is an 1878-S.

[TomB]

Then I guess the overhead is truly minimal. I had just been worried that you might be investing a relatively significant percentage of the value of the coin into getting it graded. When that happens, and it happens to many people, they then take a large hidden loss when they sell the piece. Again, please understand that I wasn't trying to be a jerk or to overly question your decisions.

[MunkyMan95]

No that's ok Tom. I welcome the questions! I wanted to see what everyone thought of the coin. This scanner is notorious for being very dark indeed. I'm just worried that the coin would be BB'd for some reason or another.

[MunkyMan95]

Also, I was surprised by Bruce's analysis because I thought MS62 with a shot at 63. That was just a guess, so I was happy when Bruce guessed higher.

[Bruceswar]

Also, I was surprised by Bruce's analysis because I thought MS62 with a shot at 63. That was just a guess, so I was happy when Bruce guessed higher.

 

Iike I said if the luster is there then you got a lock 63 shot 64. Unless the coin has worn spots in the hair, that are hard to see in the photos. The reason being is the strike is good and the hits on the coin are not bad. But without seeing the coin in hand its near impossible to be 100% on any coin going off an image. Let us know how the coin turns out.

[MunkyMan95]

Will do! The coin goes out tomorrow I believe. Overnight to NGC, graded, overnighted back, then prioritied to me from Idaho. How long do you guys think grading will take? Earlybird tier, current turnaround says 16 days. How accurate do you suppose that is?

[Bruceswar]

figure at least a month if not more. 2 max.. for the total process..

[MAULEMALL]

figure at least a month if not more. 2 max.. for the total process..

Especially this weekend.BAAAALTIMOOORE SHOW

[MunkyMan95]

Wow the guy I sent it to says around 2 weeks!! A month or two! AAH!

 

 

 

Ohh boy I'm so anxious...

[MAULEMALL]

Wow the guy I sent it to says around 2 weeks!! A month or two! AAH!

 

 

 

Ohh boy I'm so anxious...

Well He may be right.

[Bruceswar]

Wow the guy I sent it to says around 2 weeks!! A month or two! AAH!

 

 

 

Ohh boy I'm so anxious...

 

2 weeks to grade it which is 14 days.... so that means taking out for Batlimore and such getting back, etc... 3 working weeks then shipping times etc. So a month is not out of the question

[Bruceswar]

the more I look at the coin.. the more I am starting the see what looks like slight rub on the coin bringing it down to AU55 maybe.... but these images are a problem as you pointed out. We shall see. It will slab if you ask me.

[MunkyMan95]

Thanks everyone, especially Bruce, for your input. The images are a problem, maybe after it slabs I can try to get some better images. I will let you all know how things turn out!

[Connecticoin]

That coin looks like it was in a "soft flip".

 

If your friend has not sent the coin in yet, you may want to contact him and have him soak it in acetone to remove any PVC residue that may be on the coin.

 

As far as grade, hard to tell, because luster is nearly impossible to judge from a scan. If you have full cartwheel luster with no breaks, then you should get 63/64. If there is rub, 58. If you can't tell, this will be a good one to learn with!!

[MunkyMan95]

The coin went in a soft flip less than 2 weeks ago, and I got the flip from ANACS. Doubt there's PVC in it. I am very anxious to see how it grades!

[Connecticoin]

The coin went in a soft flip less than 2 weeks ago, and I got the flip from ANACS. Doubt there's PVC in it. I am very anxious to see how it grades!

 

Yeah, I am amazed that ANACS (or anyone, for that matter) still uses softflips and polybags, both of which contain PVC. Even after two weeks they will haze proofs -- there are numerous proof coins holdered by PCGS which have developed a crappy looking haze.

 

The problem is less critical with MS coins (although I imagine soft flips may haze DMPLs), but I don't take any chances and stay away from soft flips and poly bags. I just stick with the mylar 2.5 x 2.5 inch SaFlips. Also, if I buy a coin in the mail and receive it in a Soft Flip, it immediately gets an acetone bath.