can someone explains this kool-aid thing to mee?

[michael]

i keep seeing this reference to kool-aid on a few posts here and many many on pcgs.com

 

i pride myself to knowing all the lingo of numismatics but this kool- aid thing excapes mee

 

can someone please explains to mee this reference to kool-aid and what it means?

 

also what is a troll?

 

sincerely michael

[EVillageProwler]

"Kool-Aid" is a term that JTryka, I believe, started here and across the street. It is in reference to the final beverage of choice for the deluded and deceived folks at Jonestown.

 

A "troll" is a mythical creature of great size, strength and destructiveness. In this case, it means someone who comes onto an Internet message forum and makes posts that are nothing put destructive.

 

"Trolling" is also a fishing term, such as a person in a small boat on a lake who lets his pole dangle into the water as he glides along and picks up whatever he encounters... This double entendre is applicable because a "troll" here is someone who simply glides around the message board posts simply looking to create mischief.

 

EVP

 

[jtryka]

michael,

 

to clarify a bit on the Kool-aid, it is a reference to Jonestown (which was a terrible incident), but as I view it, it also applies to people who blindly follow a leader for no other reason than the leader tells them, because they are brainwashed. I first used it on the PCGS forums to reference people that blindly assume that if a coin is in a PCGS holder it's inherantly better than any other coin just because of the plastic that encases it (something I vehemently believe to be untrue). I also use the term to decry folks that collect plastic more than they collect coins, to me, the coins are the most important part of this, that's why I collect them, for the beauty and history, and concrete connection to our forebears, to others, unfortunately the coins are those annoying little discs of metal the take up space in a slab! So the short answer is that Kool-aid refers to brainwashing in the hobby (which is not limited to PCGS), and isn't really a numismatic term.

 

As for Troll/Trolling EVPs definition is pretty good, and a Troll ironically enough is what I was accused of being (though I believe falsely) on the PCGS boards which was the last straw that caused me to leave that forum and not return. So in this case the effect of the Kool-aid, was to accuse people that disagree with your view of being a Troll, so that you drive them away and eliminate debate that might shake your Kool-aid influenced beliefs. Keep in mind, these are my own opinions which are very strong at times. In the end it was a good thing, as I like this forum much better, and things have become more active here as they have gone downhill over there since the end of last year.

[KIEFERSCOINS]

Good Guys love cool-aid.

 

Cameron Kiefer

[michael]

thanks guys and!! evp!!!!!!! and jtry!!!!!!!!!

 

wow approprate and superb terms

now i see what they mean and i get it

 

in fact i could not have said it better myself

 

i hope this kool aid thing catches on with other industries as it really sums tnings up really very well in many other facets of life besides coins

 

i wish there was a kool aid alert for coins for many new collectoeds that will warn them to let the buyer beware and to ,ook closer at kool aid designated items before they take a final plunge so to speak!

 

sincerely michael

[EVillageProwler]

before they take a final plunge

 

It appears, Michael, that you certainly do get the lingo!!!

 

 

EVP

 

[braddick]

What is it called though when someone is super Pro-NGC and super Anti-PCGS?

I'd imagine whatever the drink is, the primary flavor would have to be lemons.

[jtryka]

it's still Kool-Aid braddick, just a matter of whether it's Berry Blue or traditional Fruit Punch.

[EVillageProwler]

I agree with Jeff. Any blind devotion is a form of drinking Kool-Aid, just different flavors of the stuff!

 

EVP

 

[Beijim]

So the short answer is that Kool-aid refers to brainwashing in the hobby (which is not limited to PCGS), and isn't really a numismatic term.

 

Regarding the brainwashing, it's perhaps worth observing that, with many people, only a light rinse is required.

 

Regarding Kool-Aid®, the phrases "drinking the Kool-Aid" or even "drinking the purple Kool-Aid" are common in everyday situations wherein someone wants to convey the notion that one or more people have abandoned critical judgment and are simply toeing the party line (whatever the "party" happens to be). The purple reference is because the incident in Jonestown involved grape flavored Kool-Aid.

 

Beijim

 

[michael]

wow thanks evetyone for the insightful ninsight i really get it now and that kool aid thing is really a good neat term to sum it up for me rather well indeed!

 

but as always buy what you liike like what you buy

 

make sure you understand and know exactly what you are looking at before you buy and

only buy with funds you can afford to lose discretionary funds

for fun and a hobby

 

and if you do NOT DO ALL OF THE ABOVE THAT IS OKIE

JUST

LET THE BUYER BEWARE

 

I JUST WANT EVERYONE TO GO INTO BUYING COINS WIRTH THEIR EYES WIDE OPEN! that way there is no expectations and nashing of teeth so to speak! when the hits the fan and it is time to sell the plastic making holdered rarities

 

sincerely michael

[Beijim]

Michael, that's superb advice - especially the part about going in only with discretionary funds you can afford to lose. The stories about retirees being scammed out of retirement money for get rich quick coin schemes always break your heart. If they'd followed your advice, the sad story would be avoided.

 

Beijim

 

[jtryka]

As always michael, very solid advice that extends beyond coins. Working in stocks, I can recall very clearly how many people (including my friends and relatives) were putting non-discretionary funds into tech and internet stocks in 1999 and 2000, and despite my warnings, they are still hurting today. I think there is something innate in all people to ignore the potential loss and focus solely on the potential gain. To do well, we must make a conscious effort to look at both!

[DonHeath]

Michael,

 

You touched on something that is very important. Discernment comes from the knowledge that the grade stated on the holder is just an opinion, even if it is an expert one. The stupid thing about this hobby is the willingness of some to pay 10x premiums just because of a one point difference in holder grade, without knowing what the difference in the two coins is. A barely-made-66-on-the-10th- submission may sell for 10x what a nicer 65+ will, because the purchasers have no real appreciation of what they are buying, and don't realize that on a different day, the two coins may change places. In the end you are buying a coin, not a holder. One of the best pieces of advice I ever heard was to not buy a higher grade than you understand. Maybe discernment is one of the best things to come from the coin forums. Despite all the board nonsense, any collector who visits for very long will learn that serious collectors always buy the coin. When you practice that, the argument over the holder dissolves and you learn to appreciate the holder as what it is, and the coin for itself. That is what new collectors miss.

[Wihlborg]

Very well said Don, and I could not agree more. We are supposed to be collecting the coins not the holders.

 

John

 

[msmhappy]

Ahh, pretty good thanks!!!!

 

mike.

 

dont forget! collect proof sets!!

[Beijim]

Don, let me add my compliments on putting it so well.

 

Beijim

 

[michael]

thanks to everyone i wish ecery new coin buyer could read this thread

 

if they still buy that is okie as i cant fix correct change convert anyone but myself

 

i just want to give some more information so coin buyers can have more information something to think about before they take the plunge so tospeak

 

and if they still buy that is okie as long as they know what they are gettinb themselves into!

 

as for me i got burned very badly and lost my health over it

back in the 1980's

 

i just do not want anyone to go thruogh what i did!

what an education for me

 

i guess such is life and hopefully if i can only help one person

make a better decsison then itis a good thing!

 

sincerely michael

[braddick]

Blind Loyality I'm against. Agreed. Loyality based on experience? I seek.

I am loyal to NGC. I like their product, mostly, and desire to see them continue to suceed.

I feel the same with PCGS. I want them to correct their errors and I believe they will. I trust their grading, again: mostly.

It all sure beats the heck out of coin collecting from the mid seventies to the mid eighties.

 

[LucyBop]

My latest NGC purchase! Time for my NGC Kool-Aid to get spiked with Tequila!! This coin looks lovely in the NGC holder! 1953s.

 

[EVillageProwler]

Holy Smokes, Lucy! If I drink NGC-flavored Kool-Aid, will I be able to get me one of those too?

 

I bet that the coin just great with the white core as backdrop!

 

EVP

 

[LucyBop]

It is AWESOME!!!! In the NGC holder, Me thinks me's gonna start a NGC toned Frankie Reg set!

[IrishMike]

I am laffing so hard. I started the koolaid thing on PCGS and it has nothing to do with Jonestown. A number of years back a new sports radio show started in Chicago, The Score. They were forbidden to make reference to alcoholic drinks on the air as they were doing it constantly, so when the sportscasters were talking about the Bears they used the phrase blue and orange koolaid. Bull red koolaid etc. When a diehard Bears fan called in they accused him nicely of drinking orange and blue koolaid. It was an affectionate term, one denotely loyalty.

 

When I accused people over there of drinking PCGS koolaid it wasn't meant to be derogatory but to give them pause to think. Unlike using in a sports team venue using it to only buy coins in one companies holders was and is in my opinion not only limiting yourself on options to pick up nice coins but just plain not in the essence of collecting as I see it.

 

This was never a comment that had any genesis with Jonestown.

[michael]

irishmike that was a really very clever coined phrase you did!

wow

i love it and it must be true as it ruffled lots of feathers

 

that tells me it was a true statement..............

 

also lucy that end roll toned franklin is really a neat eye appealling coin wow wow

 

wild!!!!!!!!!

 

just goes to show you there is still great coins out there to find and hopefully buy reasonably!

 

wow great responses thanks all!

 

sincerely michael