1957 D Wheat 1C - Wheat Cent Error? 1 1

[Drick6sy19]

I was roll hunting and came across this 1957-D Wheat Cent that had an interesting issue with the "B" in Liberty. It makes the B look like a "3". Has anyone come across this? Is this a grease error or something else? It doesn't appear to be circulation damage. Love to hear what people think.

[bsshog40]

It does look like it took a hit and moved the metal over. Easy to do with soft copper coins. 

[Sandon]

  Welcome to the NGC chat board. 

Actually, this appears to be a die chip, which is very common, especially on Lincoln cents of this era.  They have never been of any great value to collectors.  There was once a fad of collecting cents where such a chip formed between the "B" and "E" of "LIBERTY" that resembled the letter "I". These were avidly collected as "BIE" errors but had no real value either.  They are fun to collect.  See my topic on this issue:

 

Edited January 31, 2023 by Sandon

[bsshog40]

On 1/31/2023 at 12:28 PM, Sandon said:

  Welcome to the NGC chat board. 

Actually, this appears to be a die chip, which is very common, especially on Lincoln cents of this era.  They have never been of any great value to collectors.  There was once a fad of collecting cents where such a chip formed between the "B" and "E" of "LIBERTY" that resembled the letter "I". These were avidly collected as "BIE" errors but had no real value either.  They are fun to collect.  See my topic on this issue:

 

I'm not seeing where the liberty on your coin looks anything like the op's liberty. 

[Hoghead515]

I agree with Bobby. You can see the metal where it was hit and pushed over to the side. Post mint damage.

Edited January 31, 2023 by Hoghead515

[Drick6sy19]

@Sandon, yes that is good information regarding the BIE error. I have actually come across a few examples of those during my roll hunting. This particular one (the B looking like a 3) is the first time I've seen something like this and I wasn't having any success finding any similar information while researching this type of issue. 

@bsshog40, when I try to angle the coin to see if material has been pushed over, I don't see any additional material (I'll try and capture a picture). That being said, the material could have been chipped away.

[bsshog40]

This is where I see the B took a hit and shifted the metal over.

[EagleRJO]

On 1/31/2023 at 1:33 PM, bsshog40 said:

I'm not seeing where the liberty on your coin looks anything like the op's liberty. 

Sandon is talking about 2 different things: the missing part of the "B" on the op's coin; and a known error on a Lincoln cent where a very weak part of the die between the letters "B" and "E" breaks off creating the appearance of the letter "I" referred to as a "BIE" error.  See attached for an example.  The BIE error is one of several popular Lincoln cent die error types that people still collect, even though they may not be very valuable.

http://varietyvista.com/25 What Are Die Varieties/Die Errors.htm

[Sandon]

   I continue to think that this is a die chip.  The missing part of the "B" and the adjacent area don't look scraped, smashed or dented.  The raised metal is on both sides of and beneath the missing part of the "B".  The die appears to have chipped in this entire area, and the striking pressure wasn't enough to raise the blob from the chip to the same level as the remaining part of the "B". My opinion might be different if I could see the actual coin and not just photos. The most important point, about which we all agree, is that it's not a significant or valuable error or variety.

[Drick6sy19]

So this thread is a perfect representation of the debate I have been having in my own head. The "B"/"3" is interesting as I've never come across such an issue (albeit I don't have the wealth of experience you all have) and am intrigued by how it was created. That said, I have been debating in my own mind the very same conflicting ideas of defect/chip of the die versus simply damage from circulation. I am planning on attending the upcoming PCGS show in Vegas in a couple weeks, I was going to take it with me for some people to have a live look at it and get their opinions. I'll follow-up with the consensus I receive from that. Thanks all for the input!

[Coinbuf]

On 1/31/2023 at 1:04 PM, Sandon said:

The most important point, about which we all agree, is that it's not a significant or valuable error or variety.

This is the key takeaway, the coin at the center of this discussion is a well circulated coin with some type of damage.   We can all continue to guess what happened, however, the time this coin has spent in circulation has likely erased the evidence needed to positively identify the source of the damage.

[EagleRJO]

Even though there is agreement it's not a significant error or variety, I still find the topic interesting as there isn't agreement concerning the cause.  As opposed to the more common chime-in replies of ... damaged, took some hits, parking lot coin, agreed, PMD, etc.

On 1/31/2023 at 1:16 PM, bsshog40 said:

It does look like it took a hit and moved the metal over. Easy to do with soft copper coins. 

I'm on the fence side that it does look like damage.  The coin has taken multiple heavy hits in the area of "Liberty" including the lower part of the L, right side of the B, top of the E, and top of the T.  So it's not unreasonable to think the middle of the B also took a hit.

Copper is a very soft metal that can have small pieces pushed around if it takes a hit, and the 1957 cents were 95% copper.  I think it was @J P Mwho had one where part of a copper cent was actually moved from one part of a coin to a completely different area from a hit.

It does look like the cross bar or horizontal middle part of the B took a hit starting at the right side and going to the left, with perhaps a slope down that way.  It looks a little like the middle part stretched then broke off, shearing at the top and bottom where there is the missing part of the B, and a raised blob next to that.  There may also be some part of the B remaining at the bottom of the gap, which also seems to have a rough surface like it broke off.

The only other possibility I can think of is that there were die chips between the "I" and the "B", which is a weak part of the die (similar to what causes the "BIE" error), and that ended up filling in part of the B.  But I think the top and bottom of the missing part of the B are too well defined for that to have occurred.

That coin looks like it might be completely mangled and I am curious what the entire coin looks like.  I am also curious if the right side of the cross bar of the B actually does slope down slightly going to the left, or maybe it's just discolored.

Edited February 2, 2023 by EagleRJO

[J P M]

Welcome Drick6sy19.   Sorry to say it looks like a hit to me also. I roll hunt all the time and I see this quite a bit. The metal looks like it was pushed over many years ago like, bsshog said.  I do not know of a LIIB chip error ?  I have a BIE chip cent that looks almost the same as the one Sandon put up.