EagleRJO Posted July 15, 2022 Share Posted July 15, 2022 Prior to Mid 2021 the US Mint used these really nice felt display boxes embossed with a metal emblem on the top of an eagle and shield (see photo, left side) for the Proof ASEs, which came inside the outer cardboard mint box. Later in 2021 and now into 2022 the US Mint is going with a really cheesy felt adhered plastic holder that just goes in the outer box (see photo, right side). I really liked the old-style felt display box, and I'm pretty disappointed with the mint going with such a cheap cheesy replacement, so I sent them a complaint. What is the US Mint running out of money? ;-) GoldFinger1969 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coinbuf Posted July 15, 2022 Share Posted July 15, 2022 The director needed a raise so he can still afford tacos on taco Tuesday. Hoghead515 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EagleRJO Posted July 15, 2022 Author Share Posted July 15, 2022 That, and they are still paying off Bill Clintons cheeseburgers ... lol. Maybe the change because many are stabbing the ASEs? But still the ASE felt display boxes were really nice. Hoghead515 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWB Posted July 15, 2022 Share Posted July 15, 2022 An internal proposal, as I have been told by a reliable source, is to begin shipping proof ASEs to bulk retailers packaged only in capsules. I do not know if that has been adopted. GoldFinger1969 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VKurtB Posted July 15, 2022 Share Posted July 15, 2022 On 7/15/2022 at 6:13 PM, RWB said: An internal proposal, as I have been told by a reliable source, is to begin shipping proof ASEs to bulk retailers packaged only in capsules. I do not know if that has been adopted. It has. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EagleRJO Posted July 16, 2022 Author Share Posted July 16, 2022 Maybe starting in 2023? I just confirmed that my 2022-S Proof ASEs from the Proof ASE program enrollment are going to be fulfilled/shipped in August. If they do switch I imagine that they will sell them to dealers at a hefty bulk discount, and without the cost of boxes, which could be a bulk separate buy, so that with a dealer mark up it may be the same price, or maybe less w/o a box if you plan to get them TPG slabbed. The only bummer is that it would be bye bye being pretty confident you would at least get 3 each production enrollment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VKurtB Posted July 16, 2022 Share Posted July 16, 2022 (edited) The bulk purchase program is not a secret. Nor is there any reason for questions about it. It is right there on the Mint’s website, which IS GOOD for things other than ordering coins. https://catalog.usmint.gov/bulk-purchase-program-landing.html Edited July 16, 2022 by VKurtB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EagleRJO Posted July 16, 2022 Author Share Posted July 16, 2022 I don't see that it replaces or eliminates the individual program enrollments, but maybe that's why the last popular coins did ship out enrollments but weren't even avail to the public thru the online store cause they were already sold out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
World Colonial Posted July 16, 2022 Share Posted July 16, 2022 (edited) In response to the OP's question, I presume it's a cost saving move due to the requirement to price everything using full cost accounting. It's already $73 for what is now $19 in silver. I understand the limit is 746,000 which if it sells out, almost certainly means it's going to be another money loser later, absent a big run up in silver spot. Edited July 16, 2022 by World Colonial Hoghead515 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Bill347 Posted July 16, 2022 Share Posted July 16, 2022 I share in the disappointment in the current packaging. Twinkies are better protected than the proof ASEs. T”my Morgan CC arrived Out of its capsule. Fortunately it still pulled an MS70, my good luck. These cheesy holders are cheap! Now according the our very reliable sources, we are not even going to get the twinkies plastic.I’m pretty sure I’ll be disenrolling! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EagleRJO Posted July 16, 2022 Author Share Posted July 16, 2022 So, you think even the proof enrollments are going to just get the cheap plastic capsules? What are they going to do, wrap it in old newspapers or left-over gift wrap and mail it to you in a plain cardboard box like some of the eBay buys you get ... smh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
World Colonial Posted July 16, 2022 Share Posted July 16, 2022 $73 is a lot for $19 of silver because that's what the US Mint is actually selling. The relevant question seems to be, how much can the US Mint raise prices to cover increasing costs without pricing out most of the customer base? This is the underlying economic problem in the coin industry business model. As long as the collector base is growing with increasing flow of funds, increasing costs aren't a problem, in the aggregate. As soon as prices stagnate or decline for any period of time, the business model breaks down, in whole or in part. It's reflected in US Mint pricing. It shows up in higher TPG and auction fees. eBay essentially ruined their selling platform for most coins years ago, though I think that was more driven by efforts to increase profits and beat EPS estimates. I don't buy or sell at B&M dealers, but this is also part of the reason more of them are closing. The reason it's a problem is two-fold. First, most collectors aren't going to spend increasing amounts or proportions of their coin budget on incidental hobby expenses. Coin budgets are predominantly to buy coins, not to cover the industry's costs or provide it with profits. It's a discretionary purchase, always. Second, many collectors either can't or won't increase their coin budgets to compensate for it, certainly not with 40-YR high inflation and tightening credit conditions. GoldFinger1969 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VKurtB Posted July 16, 2022 Share Posted July 16, 2022 On 7/15/2022 at 11:07 PM, EagleRJO said: So, you think even the proof enrollments are going to just get the cheap plastic capsules? What are they going to do, wrap it in old newspapers or left-over gift wrap and mail it to you in a plain cardboard box like some of the eBay buys you get ... smh. They can’t opt for capsules. Only bulk purchases can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EagleRJO Posted July 16, 2022 Author Share Posted July 16, 2022 (edited) On 7/16/2022 at 2:15 PM, VKurtB said: They can’t opt for capsules. Only bulk purchases can. I didn't mean to suggest that you could opt for capsules, but mussing about the mint going on the cheap and first sending out the proof coins in these cheap plastic capsules set in super cheap plastic holders with glued on felt just stuffed in a box ... and that maybe next the mint will decide to send them out in the cheap plastic capsules wrapped in old newspaper and stuffed in plain folded up bubble wrap with scotch tape to make a shipping bag ... smh. The US Mint must be running out of money ... Edited July 17, 2022 by EagleRJO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VKurtB Posted July 16, 2022 Share Posted July 16, 2022 On 7/16/2022 at 1:56 PM, EagleRJO said: I didn't mean to suggest that you could opt for capsules, but mussing about the mint going on the cheap and first sending out the proof coins in these super cheap plastic holders with glued on felt just stuffed in a box, and that maybe next is them deciding to send them out in those cheap plastic capsules wrapped in old newspaper and stuffed in a plain bubble wrap fold over bag with scotch tape ... smh. The US Mint must be running out of money ... I haven’t bought ASE proofs for quite a few years. I buy the Uncirculated/Burnished ones only, and they have been in minimal packaging all along - flocked cardboard. Are you saying the proofs are now coming that way too? No spring loaded velour thingies any more? Interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J P M Posted July 17, 2022 Share Posted July 17, 2022 I think I saw somewhere you can buy the spring loaded velour thingies all alone without coins in them ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EagleRJO Posted July 17, 2022 Author Share Posted July 17, 2022 On 7/16/2022 at 5:04 PM, VKurtB said: I haven’t bought ASE proofs for quite a few years. I buy the Uncirculated/Burnished ones only, and they have been in minimal packaging all along - flocked cardboard. Are you saying the proofs are now coming that way too? No spring loaded velour thingies any more? Interesting. I only buy the proofs because I have the uncirculated bullion coins (like Mint Direct or Mint Sealed, not burnished) going back to 2005, plus a few other years, for little more than bullion bars. For the Proof ASEs no more really nice blue velour spring-loaded clamshell style display boxes since mid-2021 (see the pics). I swear it's because the US Mint is running out of money ... But maybe that's a better way to go because some put the proofs in TPG slab coffins. JP, you can buy them separately ... OGP Box & COA - 2021-W Silver American Eagle Proof (Empty) GoldFinger1969 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J P M Posted July 17, 2022 Share Posted July 17, 2022 On 7/16/2022 at 10:32 PM, EagleRJO said: I only buy the proofs because I have the uncirculated bullion coins (like Mint Direct or Mint Sealed, not burnished) going back to 2005, plus a few other years, for little more than bullion bars. For the Proof ASEs no more really nice blue velour spring-loaded clamshell style display boxes since mid-2021 (see the pics). I swear it's because the US Mint is running out of money ... But maybe that's a better way to go because some put the proofs in TPG slab coffins. JP, you can buy them separately ... OGP Box & COA - 2021-W Silver American Eagle Proof (Empty) Yes I knew I had seen them for sale at some of the online sites. It matters not to me I have never bought anything from the mint and have no reason to start now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MN1 Posted July 20, 2022 Share Posted July 20, 2022 On 7/15/2022 at 7:13 PM, RWB said: An internal proposal, as I have been told by a reliable source, is to begin shipping proof ASEs to bulk retailers packaged only in capsules. I do not know if that has been adopted. If to APMEX and MCM who will then have graded and resell in PCGS and NGC holders it would not matter to me because that would sort of be behind the scenes. However if I were to buy one or any new coin for that matter I want it packaged better. I don't want a capsule with fingerprints, scuffs, or scratches. Luckily I am not into modern coins but still for those who are, it is disappointing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EagleRJO Posted July 20, 2022 Author Share Posted July 20, 2022 On 7/17/2022 at 8:09 AM, J P Mashoke said: Yes I knew I had seen them for sale at some of the online sites. It matters not to me I have never bought anything from the mint and have no reason to start now. When possible, I buy direct from the mint so I am 100% sure of what I am getting. GoldFinger1969 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldFinger1969 Posted July 22, 2022 Share Posted July 22, 2022 On 7/16/2022 at 12:01 PM, World Colonial said: $73 is a lot for $19 of silver because that's what the US Mint is actually selling. The relevant question seems to be, how much can the US Mint raise prices to cover increasing costs without pricing out most of the customer base? This is the underlying economic problem in the coin industry business model. As long as the collector base is growing with increasing flow of funds, increasing costs aren't a problem, in the aggregate. As soon as prices stagnate or decline for any period of time, the business model breaks down, in whole or in part. It's reflected in US Mint pricing. It shows up in higher TPG and auction fees. eBay essentially ruined their selling platform for most coins years ago, though I think that was more driven by efforts to increase profits and beat EPS estimates. I don't buy or sell at B&M dealers, but this is also part of the reason more of them are closing. The reason it's a problem is two-fold. First, most collectors aren't going to spend increasing amounts or proportions of their coin budget on incidental hobby expenses. Coin budgets are predominantly to buy coins, not to cover the industry's costs or provide it with profits. It's a discretionary purchase, always. Second, many collectors either can't or won't increase their coin budgets to compensate for it, certainly not with 40-YR high inflation and tightening credit conditions. If folks are willing to buy ASEs at a slight-to-low premium to the underlying silver price...and that price rises too high for plain-vanilla ASEs....I think folks will turn to pure bullion coins or those close to it like circulated/worn Morgans or even bars etc. World Colonial 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
World Colonial Posted July 22, 2022 Share Posted July 22, 2022 On 7/22/2022 at 3:55 PM, GoldFinger1969 said: If folks are willing to buy ASEs at a slight-to-low premium to the underlying silver price...and that price rises too high for plain-vanilla ASEs....I think folks will turn to pure bullion coins or those close to it like circulated/worn Morgans or even bars etc. My opinion too. GoldFinger1969 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...