So who is up for the new NGC airview holder? 1 1

[Coinbuf]

NGC debuts a new holder called the airview

I will say that this looks great, eliminates the prongs which many collectors really hate and gives the coin a super nice picture frame look.   It does bring up some questions, how will it fair over time, will the "sandwich" materials hold up well or have issues with discoloration.   I hope it is a hit with collectors.

[Fenntucky Mike]

I agree, looks good, but have the same questions as you. I'm also wondering why they are limiting it so much, it reads like it's 100% NGC's discretion whether or not to pop a coin in one of these. Lot's of pomp and what seems to be a very limited roll out to start with. Availability, feeling out the market? 

[GoldFinger1969]

But only for SMALL coins, right ?

So not for larger coins or our classics like Saints or Morgans.

[zadok]

On 6/10/2022 at 5:51 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

But only for SMALL coins, right ?

So not for larger coins or our classics like Saints or Morgans.

...just curious...why do u refer to saints n morgans as classics?....because of their size, denominations??....im sure there r many collectors that wouldnt give either a second thought, self included...there r so many other series/denominations that seem to fit the bill as classics so much better....nothing wrong with calling any series anything, to each his/her own....but curious where u acquired/adopted that classification for those two series.....

[RWB]

The description is sparse. Sounds as if the coin is squeezed between clear, pliable layers which are then put into a slab and sealed. I wonder how this would affect photos....Will there be refraction distortions of shape or tone?

 

[Henri Charriere]

On 6/10/2022 at 6:45 PM, zadok said:

...just curious...why do u refer to saints... as classics?...

OBJECTION!  Argumentative!

One need only take a quick peek at our colleague, seasoned veteran jtryka's latest, quite gorgeous contribution -- preserved for posterity on the "Post your most recent acquisition - US" thread earlier this week, page 682 of 682, 2d post -- to conclude he has provided a substantial, legitimate, substantive claim to his use of a remarkably restrained, tame claim.

This coin, my professional brethren and fellow newbies alike, IMHO, captures the very essence of the term "classic" in living color and [minus member Buffalo Head's exquisite photographical skills] has few equals.   🐓 

 

[VKurtB]

On 6/10/2022 at 6:08 PM, RWB said:

The description is sparse. Sounds as if the coin is squeezed between clear, pliable layers which are then put into a slab and sealed. I wonder how this would affect photos....Will there be refraction distortions of shape or tone?

 

Newton rings?

[GoldFinger1969]

On 6/10/2022 at 6:45 PM, zadok said:

...just curious...why do u refer to saints n morgans as classics?

Just because they are out-of-production (excepting the 2009 UHR and the 2021 Morgan replica) and lots of people collect both series.

[zadok]

On 6/10/2022 at 10:56 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

Just because they are out-of-production (excepting the 2009 UHR and the 2021 Morgan replica) and lots of people collect both series.

...so classic as in vintage cars that r no longer made?....i guess thats ok as long as u dont buy an Edsel like QA did......

[VKurtB]

On 6/10/2022 at 9:56 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

Just because they are out-of-production (excepting the 2009 UHR and the 2021 Morgan replica) and lots of people collect both series.

Do you REALLY think “lots of people” collect $20 Saints? Wow! Compared to what?

[GoldFinger1969]

On 6/10/2022 at 11:33 PM, VKurtB said:

Do you REALLY think “lots of people” collect $20 Saints? Wow! Compared to what?

Not "lots" as compared to modern or less-expensive coins, of course not.

The best survey I saw said that there were about 50 Top Registry players (folks who want Top Coins or near the top).....about 500-1,000 Registry players who collect most of the coins or all of them but in lower grades for some coins (because of the cost)....and about 25,000 - 40,000 type collectors who might collect 1 coin or a few coins or even a few dozen of the less-expensive ones.

Beyond that....investment buyers of lower-grade commons.

 

Edited June 11, 2022 by GoldFinger1969

[Coinbuf]

On 6/10/2022 at 2:39 PM, Fenntucky Mike said:

I agree, looks good, but have the same questions as you. I'm also wondering why they are limiting it so much, it reads like it's 100% NGC's discretion whether or not to pop a coin in one of these. Lot's of pomp and what seems to be a very limited roll out to start with. Availability, feeling out the market? 

This part was a bit confusing to me as well, I do not understand the restrictions on the use of this new holder.   The way I read it sounds like this holder may not be well suited to heavy coins, perhaps there is some concern about the coin moving around between the two layers which might be exacerbated by a large or heavy coin.   It will be interesting to see how this new design works and is used.

[Just Bob]

I definitely like the look.

[physics-fan3.14]

I'm not entirely sure I understand how this holder works. So are there 2 films that are in contact with the surface of the coin on either side? That seems weird. Maybe I just need to see one in real life. 

I really like the concept of removing the god-awful prongs, especially on little coins. That has been my complaint with these holders ever since they introduced them. On some of my coins, the prongs cover up a significant portion of the coin! 

[GoldFinger1969]

On 6/12/2022 at 8:03 AM, physics-fan3.14 said:

On some of my coins, the prongs cover up a significant portion of the coin! 

You would think they would have shrunk some of them for smaller coins.

Both NGC and PCGS have prongs, right ?

 

Edited June 12, 2022 by GoldFinger1969

[ldhair]

I'm thinking the film may not be able to hold larger coins in place.

The weight of the coin may make the coin shift in the holder.

[USAuPzlBxBob]

It is an interesting concept.

However, the concept is barely revealed though we do know that the holders are the same kind of holders on the two outermost layers that we are currently familiar with.

Then we come to the new inner layers concept:  "securely suspending a coin between two layers of high-quality polymers that are both crystal clear and fully inert."

This tells us that for this to work, there needs to be built in, self centering, physics involved.  (and we also know that coins over 30 mm diameter are not eligible)

Imagine yourself trying to solve this conundrum.  How might you approach it?

I wouldn't want any sort of welding of the crystal clear high-quality layers to the white layers, I'd want it to be that these two layers would lay between the white layers in some way. Therefore, the key design element would be that the white layers would combined with the clear layers, such that when the "sandwich" results, centering forces occur.  This is suggested from the four "buttons" that exist around the display circle, at equally distant corners around the display circle.

One thing I will say with certainty, NGC will garner a lot of buzz from this new presentation holder, and with a potential patent to follow, PCGS is gong to "have a tough row to hoe" due to this NGC technological advancement.

Competition and Capitalism… it's what makes America great!

 

 

[RWB]

"So who is up for the new NGC airview holder?"

Do I get fries and a drink with that....?

[RWB]

Considerable discussion (and approval) of this on the PCGS message boards.

[USAuPzlBxBob]

It appears that The NGC Airview Holder advertisement page involves a little photoshopping.

Consider the coin, Cert # 6327127-003, used twice on the page.

One photo shows the dramatic "Blue Sky" background and the other shows the stack of "Holders" background.

Zooming in and out on my computer screen to get the two holder photos to match, width-wise at the center height of the coin, the following measurements were taken:

Description               Coin               Opening               Holder
  Blue Sky               32 mm               90 mm              142 mm
   Holders                46 mm               90 mm              142 mm

A little advertising "puffery" with the Blue Sky example.  (suspected it was a little too dramatic)

ATS, Rexford seems to have posted his own coins that involve the new NGC Airview Holders, and which reveal more fully how things will probably look. You can see the white inner layer sandwiching, which shows a seam between the layers. (NCG's advertisement page has boosted brightness and the available contrast does not show the "seam" between the white inner layers.)

[messydesk]

Here's a discussion ATS about these, including photos of actual holders (not marketing mockups), with lots of questions about them.  They look good from the photos posted.  I'd love to see one and have the chance to do some "abusive user" testing.

Edited June 13, 2022 by messydesk

[Hoghead515]

I really like the look of it. But what concerns me is, if heavy coins may shift in them then what happes if one with a light coin in it is accidentally dropped. Would the impact possibly cause the lighter coin to shift. Im always very careful handling my coins but theres always the possibility of dropping one. Were all human and it can happen. Ive accidentally dropped a couple of my other holders before. 

[Ryan S.]

It's definitely been an issue in the past when submitting ancients, NGC will just send the coin back in a flip with the words "Too fragile to holder" and sometimes include a little photo-cert thing to go with it. We had one of those come back just a few months ago on a $5k coin.

In terms of marketing, I don't think they should be advertising it so much especially since its use is at their discretion, and coming up with a name for it creates a certain level of desire.

We've had these types of holders for ancients for a long time, so it's not new technology, but I'm sure they enhanced the clarity of the film. I have a stack of the original holders on my desk right now....I call them Glade Press & Seals :-p 

As was mentioned before, I'd be a little worried about slippage on bigger coins, and possibly Newton Rings down the road. But a welcome addition to the NGC arsenal! 

[USAuPzlBxBob]

ATS, a blatant example of how pronged holders can damage a fragile coin is shown at the end of the thread. (messydesk presents the thread link a few post above)

The coin is a 1792 Quarter Dollar (white metal) and the prong indentations are clearly visible.

Here on NGC's Coin Explorer, that very coin can be seen before prongs dented it:

  

[Henri Charriere]

I see the damage but it is a giant leap of faith to even fathom the possibility that plastic prongs are the culprit where metal is involved.

[gmarguli]

I like it, but I'm not sure how revolutionary it is. Years ago PCGS slabbed some fractional Nepal Mohars for me and they used two clear discs and placed the coin in between. This is the same concept, but slightly different design.

I'd like to see this option with the white core completely gone and just have a clear plastic slab.