“What in the Wide, Wide World of Sports Is a-Goin’ on Here? 0

[VKurtB]

Where are all these trolls coming from recently? We’ve been inundated lately with new highly aggressive ignoramuses on this board who insist they have coins which they clearly do not. It’s up to about a half dozen utterly clueless new people who are just aggressively ignorant. What god have we offended? What sacred idol have we toppled? What have we done to deserve this plague of I-d-I-o-t-s who are substituting for Biblical locusts?

[Alex in PA.]

On 5/23/2022 at 5:51 PM, VKurtB said:

Where are all these trolls coming from recently?

One, maybe two, people constantly using different log ins.  Some of them go back a year or more.  They join, post, then disappear.  Then come back at a later date  and get all fired up.  Going on ATS also.

Edited May 23, 2022 by Alex in PA.

[Alex in PA.]

Be on the look out for...........

[JKK]

I don't think most of them start out as trolls. I think you (plural, referring to a subset of the regulars in general) create them.

It's the same thing every time. Someone posts something that is either stupid or annoying. They get heckled; sometimes they deserve it, and sometimes people are just being Richards (they know who they are). Pretty soon it's evident to the poster:

1. Their name is mud here. They're burned, done, hosed, marked lousy. They will not recover.
2. This forum is full of people who just cannot shut the f-bomb up, and who just have to respond to people who are not worth wasting time on.
3. Due to the above two realities, the only benefit the poster can get is the childish one of taunting and trolling just to manipulate people and watch them lose their bodily wastes. Its maturity level is about first grade, but the first-grade mentality gets a huge rod on from making old men harrumph and grouse and get their BP up. They are the kids (including adult kids who never grew up) who stick a foot on the old paternally_uncertain_person's lawn because they know he will rush right out there and yell at them. That mentality will not grow up.

At that point, a troll has been created, and the troll will troll until they get bored with it for a while. Sometimes they'll leave off for a while, then come back and manipulate the members some more. I'm not saying that the troll didn't necessarily deserve their initial mockery; sometimes they do. I'm not saying that the responses their trolling draws are unjustified; they nearly always are. I am saying that trolls perish when not fed, and this forum is a free feeding ground for them because people simply cannot resist dignifying the trolls' stoopidness.

All it takes to be rid of them is the ability not to bother with them. But that will never happen here. While there are people here with poor impulse control, there are only a few that are too mentally deficient to recognize trolls, and those actually work to the forum's benefit because they at least give the troll some lousy advice (we need more of that). The rest--this is generally not a hobby for mental defectives, though they do appear--are sharp enough to know it's a troll, but simply can't refuse to be baited. And they won't change. So that's that. We won't change it, but we can at least take responsibility where suitable.

[124Spider]

On 5/23/2022 at 4:45 PM, JKK said:

I don't think most of them start out as trolls. I think you (plural, referring to a subset of the regulars in general) create them.

It's the same thing every time. Someone posts something that is either stupid or annoying. They get heckled; sometimes they deserve it, and sometimes people are just being Richards (they know who they are). Pretty soon it's evident to the poster:

1. Their name is mud here. They're burned, done, hosed, marked lousy. They will not recover.
2. This forum is full of people who just cannot shut the f-bomb up, and who just have to respond to people who are not worth wasting time on.
3. Due to the above two realities, the only benefit the poster can get is the childish one of taunting and trolling just to manipulate people and watch them lose their bodily wastes. Its maturity level is about first grade, but the first-grade mentality gets a huge rod on from making old men harrumph and grouse and get their BP up. They are the kids (including adult kids who never grew up) who stick a foot on the old paternally_uncertain_person's lawn because they know he will rush right out there and yell at them. That mentality will not grow up.

At that point, a troll has been created, and the troll will troll until they get bored with it for a while. Sometimes they'll leave off for a while, then come back and manipulate the members some more. I'm not saying that the troll didn't necessarily deserve their initial mockery; sometimes they do. I'm not saying that the responses their trolling draws are unjustified; they nearly always are.Mohawk about thqt I am saying that trolls perish when not fed, and this forum is a free feeding ground for them because people simply cannot resist dignifying the trolls' stoopidness.

All it takes to be rid of them is the ability not to bother with them. But that will never happen here. While there are people here with poor impulse control, there are only a few that are too mentally deficient to recognize trolls, and those actually work to the forum's benefit because they at least give the troll some lousy advice (we need more of that). The rest--this is generally not a hobby for mental defectives, though they do appear--are sharp enough to know it's a troll, but simply can't refuse to be baited. And they won't change. So that's that. We won't change it, but we can at least take responsibility where suitable.

This is the first time I've posted here in over six months (and it likely will be the last time for the foreseeable future), because I just wanted to give full props to JKK for an absolutely perfect post.

This is a remarkably hostile place, with too many people who never got over being middle-school bullies.  It's just not fun to hang out here (ask Mohawk about that...).  Most of you are fine, but there are enough people who are consistently unpleasant that one is quickly put to the choice of being a troll, or going elsewhere.  I went elsewhere; Mohawk went elsewhere; I'm sure lots of others have gone elsewhere.  But you who somehow get your kicks by being nasty (it takes a particularly type of warped human to get off on being anonymously nasty to people you'll never meet) make this a very unpleasant place to hang out.

It's NGC's choice to coddle such people (and the choice of the rest of you to put up with it, instead of calling them out).  It's the choice of the rest of us to spend our time (and certification money) elsewhere.  I'm gone again; but I wanted to put an exclamation point on JWW's fine post.

Mark

[RWB]

There is a similar infestation, including some of the same persons, on PCGS' forums. An aggregate of people so brain-washed by internet lies they will believe the garbage on esty, truth.con or other piles of lies. Then, when they find a legitimate group of coin collectors they become belligerent and defensive on being shown their $5000 penny is worth 1-cent. In psychology belief can quickly turn to faith and then to irrational faith-dependence -- from which escape is difficult and sometimes impossible. Jones Town, the Bible Belt, and many other examples pervade all human societies. We are irrational creations.

[VKurtB]

On 5/23/2022 at 8:20 PM, RWB said:

There is a similar infestation, including some of the same persons, on PCGS' forums. An aggregate of people so brain-washed by internet lies they will believe the garbage on esty, truth.con or other piles of lies. Then, when they find a legitimate group of coin collectors they become belligerent and defensive on being shown their $5000 penny is worth 1-cent. In psychology belief can quickly turn to faith and then to irrational faith-dependence -- from which escape is difficult and sometimes impossible. Jones Town, the Bible Belt, and many other examples pervade all human societies. We are irrational creations.

Brilliant. Agreed. Now get that message through to about 8 statewide candidates in my state’s primary mañana. 

Edited May 24, 2022 by VKurtB

[VKurtB]

On 5/23/2022 at 7:29 PM, 124Spider said:

This is the first time I've posted here in over six months (and it likely will be the last time for the foreseeable future), because I just wanted to give full props to JKK for an absolutely perfect post.

This is a remarkably hostile place, with too many people who never got over being middle-school bullies.  It's just not fun to hang out here (ask Mohawk about that...).  Most of you are fine, but there are enough people who are consistently unpleasant that one is quickly put to the choice of being a troll, or going elsewhere.  I went elsewhere; Mohawk went elsewhere; I'm sure lots of others have gone elsewhere.  But you who somehow get your kicks by being nasty (it takes a particularly type of warped human to get off on being anonymously nasty to people you'll never meet) make this a very unpleasant place to hang out.

It's NGC's choice to coddle such people (and the choice of the rest of you to put up with it, instead of calling them out).  It's the choice of the rest of us to spend our time (and certification money) elsewhere.  I'm gone again; but I wanted to put an exclamation point on JWW's fine post.

Mark

Well Mark, when I introduced myself to NGC’s staff last year at a major show they all told me how much they enjoy my posts. Maybe you and Mohawk are the problem, hmm?

Edited May 24, 2022 by VKurtB

[GoldFinger1969]

Well, EC and his high-end Saints is someone who makes up for the trolls. 

[zadok]

On 5/23/2022 at 5:51 PM, VKurtB said:

Where are all these trolls coming from recently? We’ve been inundated lately with new highly aggressive ignoramuses on this board who insist they have coins which they clearly do not. It’s up to about a half dozen utterly clueless new people who are just aggressively ignorant. What god have we offended? What sacred idol have we toppled? What have we done to deserve this plague of I-d-I-o-t-s who are substituting for Biblical locusts?

...im totally at a loss trying to figure out what plural of ignoramuses r called.....knab, stench, span, drove, troop ????.....so many metaphors in V's questions i may have to rest before i can answer....maybe i shall achieve enlightenment? maybe not....

[Hoghead515]

On 5/23/2022 at 11:14 PM, zadok said:

...im totally at a loss trying to figure out what plural of ignoramuses r called.....knab, stench, span, drove, troop ????.....so many metaphors in V's questions i may have to rest before i can answer....maybe i shall achieve enlightenment? maybe not....

Im gonna have to rest on it also my friend. Just pulled a 18 hr day.  Just got home bout an hr ago. Gotta get back up in 3 hrs and hit it again. Maybe if I can keep getting hrs like these that set of Franklins will come together a little quicker. Or that set of quarters I been working on so long. Ill be happy with which ever I can find a nice example of first. 

[zadok]

On 5/24/2022 at 12:08 AM, Hoghead515 said:

Im gonna have to rest on it also my friend. Just pulled a 18 hr day.  Just got home bout an hr ago. Gotta get back up in 3 hrs and hit it again. Maybe if I can keep getting hrs like these that set of Franklins will come together a little quicker. Or that set of quarters I been working on so long. Ill be happy with which ever I can find a nice example of first. 

[Alex in PA.]

On 5/24/2022 at 9:55 AM, SlickCoins said:

let's take my story for example.

Oh, we have.  These good people on this forum, who have decades of knowledge in coin collecting, have been patient with your one after another Walmart parking lot finds.  Only a troll keeps posting junk coin pictures by the dozen, and then attempts to con people and continually argue with people into believing well known experts validate his pathetic creations.  I do not know if you are just a lonely person needing attention or a fool trying to disrupt this forum.  Yes, we have seen your 'story'.  

Edited May 24, 2022 by Alex in PA.

[VKurtB]

As I recall BOTH 124Spider AND Mohawk were fond of taking highly politicized potshots and then getting all defensive when somebody “returned fire”. Mohawk is a profound loss numismatically here, but Spider not at all. 

[VKurtB]

On 5/24/2022 at 9:41 AM, SlickCoins said:

Ok let's change this topic to a me topic,,, no this is V_Kurt_B's post,, I'm simply responding to a great thread.

Alex if you wanna pounce me and how I do these things,,, I've got plenty of posts which you're more than welcome to post.

How does one con by just giving opinions?

Thanks and sorry Kurt

NEVER apologize to me for taking a thread in a wandering direction. These are CONVERSATIONS to me and that happens in conversations. Carry on sir. 
 

Now, as pertains to your 1978D cent, I have no recollection of it, but I almost feel as if I’m missing nothing because trust me, there is no such thing as a numismatically interesting 1978D LMC. Sorry, there just isn’t. 

[Alex in PA.]

On 5/24/2022 at 10:41 AM, SlickCoins said:

How does one con by just giving opinions?

YOU did NOT give us YOUR opinions.  YOU told us that very famous and well known people in the field of Numismatics were communicating to YOU that you had these fantastic errors.  Go back and reread YOUR comments.

Edited May 24, 2022 by Alex in PA.

[VKurtB]

On 5/24/2022 at 10:12 AM, Alex in PA. said:

YOU did NOT give us YOUR opinions.  YOU told us that very famous and well known people in the field of Numismatics were communicating to YOU that you had these fantastic errors.  Go back and reread YOUR comments.

On which? The 1978D or just the indisputably fake early cent. 

[Alex in PA.]

On 5/24/2022 at 11:19 AM, VKurtB said:

just the indisputably fake early cent. 

That's part of my reasoning.  When one of these so called 'Newbies' goes on Etsy or Alibaba and buys one of those 18th Century 'gold' (LOL) coins then comes here making the statements about their 'wonderful' find.  Then, when a few of us describe it as fake the argument of how unlearned we are begins.  And it will never end.  How many posts by knowledgeable people, or people who truly come to learn, get over ridden when the troll keeps his post going.  

 

[VKurtB]

On 5/24/2022 at 11:03 AM, SlickCoins said:

Just like how I'm sure everyone is labeling Dinesh in his 2000 Mules movie.

Here to remind you kind sir {MRIL} Mint Rod Impact Lighting,,,,aka the moon landing and or ghost orbs, Horitz S under the D aka train wreck.

Thanks

I served as the County Election Director in Berks County, Pennsylvania. (For those that watched the returns news last week, that was the county that kept the polls open an extra hour because the poll workers couldn’t figure out electronic pollbooks.) I not only KNOW that election fraud is real, I know about 10 different ways it is done. D’Souza only scratched the surface. My Election Board referred the election crimes I brought to them to the District Attorney, who sat on them and did not prosecute. 

Edited May 24, 2022 by VKurtB

[VKurtB]

On 5/24/2022 at 9:56 AM, SlickCoins said:

Well I'll be the first to say it,,, it sucks being branded.

Thanks all

Getting “branded”, as you call it, is a completely 100% self-inflicted wound. There are numerous (literally) prize-winning numismatists on this board. This is not some “end of the bar Cliff Claven” thing. 

[Alex in PA.]

On 5/24/2022 at 1:08 PM, VKurtB said:

Getting “branded”, as you call it, is a completely 100% self-inflicted wound.

You'll never convince this one of that.   It must be one of us that's the problem.

Edited May 24, 2022 by Alex in PA.

[VKurtB]

On 5/24/2022 at 12:39 PM, Alex in PA. said:

You'll never convince this one of that.   It must be one of us that's the problem.

Has he taken any formal courses in numismatics?

[VKurtB]

On 5/24/2022 at 12:54 PM, SlickCoins said:

No sir I have not but after all this it sure seems like it,I mean been to any formal learning events & upon further reading.

I said a bunch but I didn't say these were errors but I did say I think they should be and if not,,,,I deem them cheater coins and wouldn't be able to submit them.

If you're talking bout the experts I've quoted,,, yes some very highly distinguished coin enthusiasts, it's cause what has been said to me and I'm brutally honest.

I'm not trying to put expert vs expert just this is super confusing and I've made it no where.

Thanks

I think you may be misinterpreting what some people say. People who go out of their way to be “diplomatic” with their opinions often engender “false hope”. I don’t do that. I don’t do “diplomatic” any more. Maybe it was the part of my brain that died in 2009 during my cerebral hemorrhage. Maybe it’s because I worked in and around politics for  20 years. Maybe it’s just that my age is now 67. Maybe it’s because I spent a good portion of my legislative service dealing with the “angry crazies” because I was, get this, THE MOST EMPATHETIC GUY IN THE OFFICE, and I’m now tired to death of it. I don’t have time for anything but brutal frankness any more. Especially when I smell the fetid stench of Internet on somebody. 

[VKurtB]

On 5/24/2022 at 1:36 PM, SlickCoins said:

we need young fresh blood with the heart of a true treasure hunter not only in coins but within life itself.

Why? It’s helpful to absolutely nothing and no one in this hobby. All it does is drag this hobby into the dirt. 

[VKurtB]

On 5/24/2022 at 1:48 PM, SlickCoins said:

Hmmm cause I tend to believe they'd investigate further not based on high school drama,,, that's why.

Thanks

And who has? Seriously, this is not a field where you can gain ANY respect by making 💩 up on the fly. It has to have a precedent. It has to have scholarship behind it FIRST. 

[VKurtB]

On 5/24/2022 at 2:11 PM, SlickCoins said:

That way we are all programmed puppets,,, hmmm I'd rather learn from our ancestors in fact if you bash them their words become an equal or better representation of coins.

Here's an example:

How many pages are in your books vs our ancestors books?

Thanks

What are you even saying? Who are these “ancestors” you speak of? Stop talking in riddles. Numismatic scholarship works in one direction. Older is worse, and newer is better, in dead tree literature. Any charlatan can post 💩online anywhere at any time. 

Edited May 24, 2022 by VKurtB

[VKurtB]

On 5/24/2022 at 2:20 PM, SlickCoins said:

Pick any coin Google it,,, most likely PCGS will pop up and they are using Breen info,,, sleepy hollows is no where on the list.

That's one that we know of another few before him, if you understand Yoda code.

The internet has everyone but you all is my point.

Breen’s work has been largely discredited by later scholarship. And especially as it pertains to numismatics, the VAST MAJORITY of what is on the Internet is pure garbage put there by people who have no idea what they’re talking about. Even major auction catalogs sometimes contain discredited misinformation. 

Edited May 24, 2022 by VKurtB

[VKurtB]

On 5/24/2022 at 2:31 PM, SlickCoins said:

Yeah I think the year is 1917 explain kind sir,, please I guess this is where right it all went to lying Breen?

I didn't Google it but sounds fresh for you all.

Thanks

Breen has been “caught” making up stuff out of whole cloth numerous times. 

[VKurtB]

Actually, the MAIN reason Breen’s work is being canceled is the fact that he was a card-carrying NAMBLA member child molester. 

[Hoghead515]

On 5/24/2022 at 4:55 PM, VKurtB said:

Actually, the MAIN reason Breen’s work is being canceled is the fact that he was a card-carrying NAMBLA member child molester. 

Not only just a child molestor but a serial child molestor. Ive got nothing for people like that. Dont want to say what Id like to do to those type people. They got nothing I want to read. 

Edited May 24, 2022 by Hoghead515