Hinkle Posted February 3, 2022 Share Posted February 3, 2022 Hi everyone, couldn't help but to show these. I opened a roll of 1956- Ds and came across these different pompadours. Most I have out of the roll is pointed and connected to his forehead. And only eight I found with out the point. I'm trying to do alot of searching on this like going back to the 55s and 57s just to see the difference. I might be going a little overboard here , but could there be something about this that I don't know. Thanks for any suggestions on this. The Neophyte Numismatist 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenstang Posted February 3, 2022 Share Posted February 3, 2022 The first one looks normal and the other two are from various stages of die polishing. RWB 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mohawk Posted February 3, 2022 Share Posted February 3, 2022 Hi Joe!! Those are some pretty cool examples of what can happen with overzealous die polishing, as Greenstang said. But they're pretty cool to look at, I have to say. Thanks for sharing those! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hinkle Posted February 3, 2022 Author Share Posted February 3, 2022 On 2/2/2022 at 7:18 PM, Greenstang said: The first one looks normal and the other two are from various stages of die polishing. Thanks Greenstang, I was leaning towards die polishing also. Interesting peice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hinkle Posted February 3, 2022 Author Share Posted February 3, 2022 On 2/2/2022 at 7:24 PM, Mohawk said: Hi Joe!! Those are some pretty cool examples of what can happen with overzealous die polishing, as Greenstang said. But they're pretty cool to look at, I have to say. Thanks for sharing those! Thanks Tom, just happen to stumble across these. I was looking for the shadow D RPM but no luck there either. O well back to hunting. Mohawk 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mohawk Posted February 3, 2022 Share Posted February 3, 2022 On 2/2/2022 at 9:28 PM, Hinkle said: Thanks Tom, just happen to stumble across these. I was looking for the shadow D RPM but no luck there either. O well back to hunting. That's the spirit!!! Get back out there and keep searching. I hope you find that shadow D. You deserve it. Hinkle 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWB Posted February 3, 2022 Share Posted February 3, 2022 Compare your coins with a 1909 or 1910 Lincoln, and notice how much the master die has deteriorated over time. The compare with a 1968 example for even more "mush." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mohawk Posted February 3, 2022 Share Posted February 3, 2022 (edited) On 2/2/2022 at 9:38 PM, RWB said: Compare your coins with a 1909 or 1910 Lincoln, and notice how much the master die has deteriorated over time. The compare with a 1968 example for even more "mush." 1968's are easily the worst looking Lincolns. Even the proofs look bad. It's quite interesting to put a 1968 and a 1969 Lincoln Cent side by side.....what a difference a new master die can make! Edited February 3, 2022 by Mohawk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWB Posted February 3, 2022 Share Posted February 3, 2022 On 2/2/2022 at 9:41 PM, Mohawk said: 1968's are easily the worst looking Lincolns. Even the proofs look bad. It's quite interesting to put a 1968 and a 1969 Lincoln Cent side by side.....what a difference a new master die can make! Yeah. I remember being having to look twice when I got my 1969 proof sets. The improvement was remarkable. Mohawk 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mohawk Posted February 3, 2022 Share Posted February 3, 2022 On 2/2/2022 at 9:44 PM, RWB said: Yeah. I remember being having to look twice when I got my 1969 proof sets. The improvement was remarkable. They need to do something about the obverse of the Shield cents now. That obverse looks really flat and lifeless, IMHO. I can see how they tried to improve it from the 1990's style obverse, but it really isn't much of an improvement. My fiancée and I had lunch with my dad last week and he isn't even a collector and he commented on how unappealing the Shield cents are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woods020 Posted February 3, 2022 Share Posted February 3, 2022 On 2/2/2022 at 8:49 PM, Mohawk said: They need to do something about the obverse of the Shield cents now. That obverse looks really flat and lifeless, IMHO. I can see how they tried to improve it from the 1990's style obverse, but it really isn't much of an improvement. My fiancée and I had lunch with my dad last week and he isn't even a collector and he commented on how unappealing the Shield cents are. Our coins are complete garbage these days. The art and beauty of the classics is long gone. I think if the mint did a retro series it would be a big hit. Similar to what they did with the Morgans and Peace dollars but with some more interesting coins. Mohawk 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fenntucky Mike Posted February 3, 2022 Share Posted February 3, 2022 On 2/2/2022 at 11:29 PM, Woods020 said: Our coins are complete garbage these days. The art and beauty of the classics is long gone. I think if the mint did a retro series it would be a big hit. Similar to what they did with the Morgans and Peace dollars but with some more interesting coins. The RM's The Great Engravers Series is a smash hit with collectors something similar from the U.S. Mint would no doubt be even more so, but I have zero confidence that the reproduced designs would look as good. I'm pretty sure the U.S. Mint will be replicating more classic designs in the very near future. Mohawk and Woods020 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Bob Posted February 3, 2022 Share Posted February 3, 2022 On 2/2/2022 at 8:38 PM, RWB said: Compare your coins with a 1909 or 1910 Lincoln, and notice how much the master die has deteriorated over time. The compare with a 1968 example for even more "mush." Help me out here: Am I misunderstanding, or are you saying that the same master die was used until 1968? Variety Vista lists 23 different obverse varieties between 1909 and 1968, involving modifications to the date, lettering, and design. How were the different die varieties - 1960 large and small dates, just to name one example - created? Were the working hubs modified? JAnsley 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWB Posted February 3, 2022 Share Posted February 3, 2022 A design master die has no date. It is the original "original" from which all subsequent annual master dies and master hubs ultimately come from. The same master die (sometimes referred to as a "master matrix die") for the Lincoln cent obverse was used from March 1909, when it was pressed from the first Janvier lathe reduction until 1968. (The problems relating to Brenner's models and the casts are described and illustrated in Renaissance of American Coinage 1909-1915.) Here is the notebook entry for the original Lincoln cent reductions. JAnsley 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Bob Posted February 3, 2022 Share Posted February 3, 2022 Does that mean that this paragraph from Wexler's "How Dies Are Made" is not accurate, or am I still confusing things? When the Janvier Reduction Lathe was introduced in 1907, the first two digits of the date began to appear on the galvano and thus on the master hubs. This was done so that the master hub could be used to make master dies over a period of several years. Starting with the Lincoln cents in 1909, the last two digits of the date were engraved into the master die for each year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Bill347 Posted February 3, 2022 Share Posted February 3, 2022 RWB here are some pictures of two Lincoln cents. The first is a 1909 VDB the second is a 1958 D I am not noticing significant differences in the two coins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member: Seasoned Veteran DWLange Posted February 3, 2022 Member: Seasoned Veteran Share Posted February 3, 2022 I'm aware of only a single new obverse master hub prior to 1969's complete overhaul. For 1916 all details of Lincoln's hair and beard were sharpened to a degree that would have required a replacement hub, and this resulted in the boldest coins of the entire series when the working dies were fresh. The 1916 cents are vastly superior in fine details to the 1909-14 coins, though the 1915 master die received some touch up that was more full realized with the new 1916 hub. Compare the two photos below to see the differences. Most of these delicate details wore away during the high mintages of 1916-20, and that erosion continued right up through 1968. Mr.Bill347 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
