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For the love of silver
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2,156 posts in this topic

On 9/2/2021 at 9:26 PM, Quintus Arrius said:

I've always wondered whether anyone would be able to figure that out. I do not even know if he is aware his name and accomplishments have permeated the internet. Officially, I am through buying. Never had relatives, my background is shrouded in an impenetrable historical mist, both my parents are deceased, I had no trouble predicting either sibling would marry.. In short, NGC is my extended family as I do not have heirs. My wife? I asked her what's at the North Pole. She said: I don't know.  I asked her if there was a sign there, reading North Pole. She guessed, yes. I asked her if anyone had had seen it.  She said, yes, but had no idea why such a sign may have put it there, why, or who might see it. She never knew  man had been to the moon years ago. She only had two questions:  "How did they get there?" and "what did they see?" 

Attn: Moderators... forgive me. I love my wife!

They took away some garbage, and left other garbage. Classic Ricardian economics. 

Edited by VKurtB
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On 9/2/2021 at 10:58 PM, zadok said:

no signs there...there is a russian flag on the sea bed 4000+ feet below, n once was a reflective sphere located there but long gone...i do have my bluenose certificate, so u can accept previous statements as credible...cant attest to moon signage didnt get that far....

The Great Zadok has spoken!

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On 8/19/2021 at 4:49 PM, zadok said:

right thigh, right breast, gown clasp, bottom curl, right wrist, left ankle, edge boulder, curl above ear....just enuf to take out of mint state....but id buy it as an au58......

I was going to go there but for obvious reasons will refrain....

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"First Day of Issue" is self-explanatory.  But at what point does a "First Srike" become a second one or is that where First Day of Issue comes in? 

Alternately, is there a limit as to how many "First Srikes" can be so designated?

Enquiring minds, newbies and oldies alike, want to know.

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On 9/4/2021 at 8:11 AM, Quintus Arrius said:

"First Day of Issue" is self-explanatory.  But at what point does a "First Srike" become a second one or is that where First Day of Issue comes in? 

Alternately, is there a limit as to how many "First Srikes" can be so designated?

Enquiring minds, newbies and oldies alike, want to know.

I know..I stopped thinking or actually caring about it. I always think "First Strike" in Military terms...So, to me, in my head, in coin universe, the First Strike is the last struck coins from the U.S. Mint for a particular series, that were shipped and stored in the Distribution Facility. The last remaining coins in the Distribution Centers would be First Strikes, hence the Delivery cycle??? this I have heard...Echoing off Planets and Moons from station to station...Even though I'm a CAC Lover, I still always focus on coin first...or in this Rare instance a Medal. I'm not really a Medal Fan but I respect them. This was purchased for a completely different reason....How many FS can be designated...I don't know...how many are there? That can be looked up...

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On 9/4/2021 at 3:18 PM, Numismatic, A.A.S. said:

...the First Strike is the last struck coins from the U.S. Mint for a particular series, that were shipped and stored in the Distribution Facility. The last remaining coins in the Distribution Centers would be First Strikes, hence the Delivery cycle??? this I have heard...Echoing off Planets and Moons from station to station...

I respect your beliefs, but in no particular order I would like to hear a few other members weigh in on this, including, but in no particular order, the following as they wish:  @DWLange, @RWB, @VKurtB, @Just Bob & @Coinbuf.

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On 9/4/2021 at 8:11 AM, Quintus Arrius said:

"First Day of Issue" is self-explanatory.  But at what point does a "First Srike" become a second one or is that where First Day of Issue comes in? 

Alternately, is there a limit as to how many "First Srikes" can be so designated?

Enquiring minds, newbies and oldies alike, want to know.

The quoted terms are sales/marketing terms as used by TPGs. They have no more meaning than "New! Improved" on your laundry detergent, or "Healthy" on salted deep fried lard.

A numismatic definition of "first strike" exists from the 19th century. It literally means the first complete, successful coin made from a new pair of dies. There is, by definition, only one such coin from each new pair of dies, and only one overall from production. (See Columbian halves story and Remington Typewriter Corp.)

One could reasonably call the #2 to, say, #100 coins "early strikes" but that would require both counting and examination. Such coins would have the characteristics of pieces made from fresh dies without the luster that soon forms from use. The exact cutoff would have to be an observational determination --- not something that will happen in a production environment.

Edited by RWB
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On 9/4/2021 at 6:44 PM, Fenntucky Mike said:

Combo.png.366ed8c68f7d197c3c232870fa48ef01.png

Nice Ukrainian 2 million karbovantsiv commemorative the 10th anniversary of the Chernobyl tragedy. This is the version with the UN 1995 obverse. (The birds are Ukranian White Storks (cranes) which are symbols of family, and also of loss and renewal.)

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On 9/5/2021 at 6:29 AM, Quintus Arrius said:

I respect your beliefs, but in no particular order I would like to hear a few other members weigh in on this, including, but in no particular order, the following as they wish:  @DWLange, @RWB, @VKurtB, @Just Bob & @Coinbuf.

It’s a complete and utter marketing scam, nothing more. @RWB has nailed it. 

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On 9/5/2021 at 4:50 PM, Coinbuf said:

@RWB is correct that all these special first strike this and first day that is almost all just hyperbole used to sell to the uneducated QVC type buyers.   It all means nothing, just marketing and a way for dealers to sell multiple examples of the very same thing to the very same customers.    From what I've said some may think that I'm "dumping" on or that I consider the buyers of these labels insufficiently_thoughtful_persons, that is not true at all.   I have no issue with anyone that buys these coins, I just want them to be educated about what they are buying so that they are not paying a premium price for non premium goods.

It is not that dissimilar to the use of the term "error coins" most of which are not errors at all but rather just damaged, mangled, coins which if the mint had good quality controls would be retrieved and melted for scrap.   But it is much easier for a dealer to sell a coin called an error than a coin which is referred to as damaged, thus the market for damaged junk was born.

Unfortunately the hobby is, and always has been, full of traps, pitfalls, hype, and outright boldface lies.    That is why education about how coins are made is so valuable to collectors, if you know how something is made you can then be in the position to know when your leg is being pulled.

 

On 9/5/2021 at 7:29 AM, Quintus Arrius said:

I respect your beliefs, but in no particular order I would like to hear a few other members weigh in on this, including, but in no particular order, the following as they wish:  @DWLange, @RWB, @VKurtB, @Just Bob & @Coinbuf.

Uneducated QVC type buyers...? I need more clients like that.

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On 9/5/2021 at 5:48 PM, Numismatic, A.A.S. said:

 

Uneducated QVC type buyers...? I need more clients like that.

The only thing more abundant than stupidity in this hobby are the con men ready to take advantage of it. 

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On 9/5/2021 at 9:56 PM, VKurtB said:

The only thing more abundant than stupidity in this hobby are the con men ready to take advantage of it. 

The thing that kills me is by simply investigating that seller, my inbox continues to fill up with eBay scamsters with come-ons -- and I never even got a chance to place a bid!  It was already 3x melt w/postage, and I guess the seller was obligated to wait out the full bidding period. Very sorry state of affairs.

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@Numismatic, A.A.S. You bring up a good point which behooves us all to equal or better it.  If someone were to ask you if you could ever possibly be the victim of a scam such as those that seem to afflict the elderly and infirm, intermittently, involving the loss of their entire life savings, you would likely state with no equivocation that such could never happen to you, correct?  But the simple truth of the matter is the practiced scam artist has had an abundance of time with which to hone his craft and with a heightened sense of smell to vulnerabilities such as indecisiveness and vaccilation, chooses his weapon from a vast array with great care and strikes with precision.

As it takes two to tango, he is powerless against the educated consumer with a strong resolve against those appealing for his complicity as dictated by common sense, logic and similar prior experience.  

Your state lottery says, You have to be in it to win it. And I have no opinion on those who do so long as they understand what gambling and casinos are in business for.  I believe the vast majority of winners are the ones who stay out of them.  Nothing is guaranteed in life but you'll do better if you take your time, familiarize yourself with the subject matter and deal with reputable sources with a proven track record of success.  And since it is difficult for a simple person with simple tastes to win big consistently, you can always modify your expectations and learn how to minimize your losses. Very often you can come out ahead by doing absolutely nothing at all but walk away.  😉 

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On 9/5/2021 at 11:04 PM, Numismatic, A.A.S. said:

Strong statement, not that you considered the dealers and influential persons involved in that process.

I do include the wholesalers in my mini-rant, at least. And that includes at least two ANA “Dealers of the Year”, probably more.

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On 9/7/2021 at 5:00 PM, Coinbuf said:

1897ds-Comp Reflection.jpg

Beautiful coin, but I LOVE the image and layout. Did you take this? I may have to get some info on how you put this together. I just ordered my photo setup from Ray finally. Ready to get after it with some coin photos. 

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On 9/8/2021 at 11:00 AM, Woods020 said:

Beautiful coin, but I LOVE the image and layout. Did you take this? I may have to get some info on how you put this together. I just ordered my photo setup from Ray finally. Ready to get after it with some coin photos. 

PLEASE!  Tell me when you get the photography portion down.  I am at a loss as to get the best images possible.  Ala, Stacks or HA.  

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On 9/8/2021 at 9:00 AM, Woods020 said:

Beautiful coin, but I LOVE the image and layout. Did you take this? I may have to get some info on how you put this together. I just ordered my photo setup from Ray finally. Ready to get after it with some coin photos. 

No these images were done for me by Mark Goodman, he takes phenomenal coin images.   I think he shot this coin back in the early twenty teens, not sure exactly when but long before I got semi serious with my photo setup from Ray.    The layout was put together by a member of the PCGS forum in the early 2000's which he was gracious enough to share with the forum.   If you have photoshop (I use elements) I would be happy to share the templates that were given to me by that member, I think I have 5 different templates.   It takes some time to do each of these reflection photos as you have 4 photo layers plus the prep of the original photos to fit the template, once you do a couple it gets easier.  

 

Edited to add: Mark literally wrote the book on coin photography Link to Marks's book if you can find it it is a gold mine of information on taking coin photos.   But his website also has some tips and pointers Mark's website look under articles and then basic coin photography to start.

Edited by Coinbuf
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