Roger Burdette's Saint Gaudens Double Eagles Book 4 4

[GoldFinger1969]

Cracks and Collapsing Dies, Double Eagles - 1920's.....(p. 323) is one of the in-between chapters that is must reading or re-reading if you want more information about what Roger and others talked about regarding die breaks, cracks, etc.

Great pics and descriptions.  I think there's another section later in the book that talks more about it as I recall but don't quote me.

Edited May 12, 2023 by GoldFinger1969

[GoldFinger1969]

European Hoarding:  I found the section on European hoarding of gold in late-1931/early-1932 to be fascinating.  They clearly wanted gold, their own governments wouldn't give it to them, they imported what may have been as much as 1.8 million Double Eagles (probably much less, as smaller denominations also went overseas).  Still, it may be a pretty accurate guestimate.

Lends credence to QDB's recounting that he could get a legit quote on tens of thousands of Double Eagles from a Swiss bank with no problem.

The huge increase in France's share of global gold reserves -- from 7% in the mid-1920's to 27% by 1932 -- gets overlooked when looking at the cause of deflationary monetary tightening.  The U.S. Federal Reserve and Smoot-Hawley seem to get most of the blame, whereas what happened from 1926-32 gets overlooked (including the readmission and ejection of the UK from the gold standard).  The monetary and gold actions of other central banks is just now getting looked at in recent years.  Indeed, even Milton Friedman said if he knew in the 1950's what he knew in the late-1990's about the French central bank, he'd have had a slightly different emphasis on The Depression with respect to the Federal Reserve.

[RWB]

On 5/14/2023 at 11:35 AM, GoldFinger1969 said:

readmission and ejection of the UK from the gold standard

GB was not "readmitted and ejected...from the gold standard." That is complete nonsense. Adherence to any arbitrary monetary standard - such as gold or pork bellies - is made by individual nations. There is and never was any "readmission and ejection" authority anywhere at anytime.

If the little chart is carried forward to Bretton Woods agreement. the overall picture is quite different. Hardy simply omitted what he didn't like. A more informative and less biased chart would extend from 1900 - the official US Gold Standard Act - to Bretton Woods.

[GoldFinger1969]

On 5/14/2023 at 11:48 AM, RWB said:

GB was not "readmitted and ejected...from the gold standard." That is complete nonsense.

I meant they got back in to the global gold standard (at a very high exchange rate for the pound) in 1925 and then were forced to leave in 1931.  I didn't mean to imply it was a club and they applied for admission ! 

[GoldFinger1969]

On 5/14/2023 at 11:48 AM, RWB said:

If the little chart is carried forward to Bretton Woods agreement. the overall picture is quite different. Hardy simply omitted what he didn't like. A more informative and less biased chart would extend from 1900 - the official US Gold Standard Act - to Bretton Woods.

But my focus was on France from 1926-32....so for that purpose, I think the chart is meaningful.  BTW, this was from a Cato Institute piece not Hardy research. 

But if you have one from 1900-45, by all means show it.  Would be interesting to see it over that time. 

[Henri Charriere]

On 5/14/2023 at 11:35 AM, GoldFinger1969 said:

The huge increase in France's share of global gold reserves -- from 7% in the mid-1920's to 27% by 1932 -- gets overlooked.... 

This may explain, in part, why the French 20-franc gold roosters were demonetized in 1928 and why "redistributions" of what we refer to as "re-strikes" dated 1907 were minted in 1921, and the rest of the series, 1908 to 1914, were minted/redistributed/restruck in the 1950's and 1960's.

[GoldFinger1969]

On 5/14/2023 at 12:31 PM, Henri Charriere said:

This may explain, in part, why the French 20-franc gold roosters were demonetized in 1928 and why "redistributions" of what we refer to as "re-strikes" dated 1907 were minted in 1921, and the rest of the series, 1908 to 1914, were minted/redistributed/restruck in the 1950's and 1960's.

The French Central Bank and her governor escape the scrutiny that the Bank of England and the U.S. Federal Reserve get while studying the 1920's and 1930's.  By one estimate, the monetary tightening globally was 60% U.S., 40% France.  Just numbers, but does go to show you that France sort of skated under the radar until recently when looking at monetary tightening leading up to and through the depths of The Great Depression.

I found the quote from Milton Friedman fascinating....about how he would have looked at things differently if he had access to the French archives when he and Anna Schwartz wrote their monetary history book.

Edited May 15, 2023 by GoldFinger1969

[GoldFinger1969]

On 5/14/2023 at 12:31 PM, Henri Charriere said:

This may explain, in part, why the French 20-franc gold roosters were demonetized in 1928 and why "redistributions" of what we refer to as "re-strikes" dated 1907 were minted in 1921, and the rest of the series, 1908 to 1914, were minted/redistributed/restruck in the 1950's and 1960's.

That would mesh with what I am reading about the French Central Bank and their policy on gold reserves (accumulating) but not distributing them to the French populace.  Not as sure about the 1950's/1960's which would be post-War and Bretton Woods.

But I don't think my initial readings about the gold standard and exchange rates in the 1920's and 1930's almost 40 years ago came across that huge increase in the gold holdings of France.  Really does put things in perspective -- doesn't get the U.S. or the FRB off the hook, but the Blame Game spreads a bit. 

[Henri Charriere]

[This is an extraordinary thread.  I can definitely understand your concerns regarding its preservation a ways back. Discussions elsewhere are sparce. You and your communicative source, RWB, have done very well. At last count, there were roughly 75 set registrants of Roosters, none of whom, to my knowledge, have ever spoken up. Few offer e-mail adresses; none respond.]

[GoldFinger1969]

On 5/14/2023 at 10:43 PM, Henri Charriere said:

[This is an extraordinary thread.  I can definitely understand your concerns regarding its preservation a ways back. Discussions elsewhere are sparce. You and your communicative source, RWB, have done very well. At last count, there were roughly 75 set registrants of Roosters, none of whom, to my knowledge, have ever spoken up. Few offer e-mail adresses; none respond.]

Roger did a great job for each year or mint Double Eagle of telling that year's/mints story.  Same with the in-between chapter stories.  I have gotten so much more out of them reading it a 2nd time -- and focusing on the footnotes, too.

For decades, I just considered a footnote a little marker that told you where something was sourced or came from.  Then, sometimes you got additional details with words.  Now, you sometimes find that you may want to segue off into that source item and read it in its entirety, as with some of the studies of the Central Banks during the 1920's and 1930's, especially the French Central Bank.

Must be something specific about the FCB and Roosters during the 1920's; I'll check around. 

Edited May 15, 2023 by GoldFinger1969

[GoldFinger1969]

On 5/14/2023 at 12:31 PM, Henri Charriere said:

This may explain, in part, why the French 20-franc gold roosters were demonetized in 1928 and why "redistributions" of what we refer to as "re-strikes" dated 1907 were minted in 1921, and the rest of the series, 1908 to 1914, were minted/redistributed/restruck in the 1950's and 1960's.

Another useful chart....

[GoldFinger1969]

And another one.....

 

[GoldFinger1969]

More......

Edited June 2, 2023 by GoldFinger1969

[Henri Charriere]

On 6/1/2023 at 10:47 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

More......

[Afghanistan, North Korea, Myanmar, have abundant supply stocks but they are known by a different name.  An audit conducted by the U.S., and its coalition partners disclosed there were no significant stocks, if ever, left but at least they were able to locate a hermit in a spider hole to show something for their efforts.]  🤣

Edited June 2, 2023 by Henri Charriere
Routine die polishing

[RWB]

Adding Saint-Gaudens' original coinage commission acceptance letter. (See separate thread, elsewhere.)

[GoldFinger1969]

Roger, that wasn't in your book, right ?  Did you just find this or kept it out for space reasons ?

Edited June 6, 2023 by GoldFinger1969

[RWB]

On 6/6/2023 at 5:53 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

Roger, that wasn't in your book, right ?  Did you just find this or kept it out for space reasons ?

Found it today. This is the letter that really started the Renaissance of American Coinage 1905-1921. Completely unexpected discovery.

[GoldFinger1969]

On 6/6/2023 at 6:14 PM, RWB said:

Found it today. This is the letter that really started the Renaissance of American Coinage 1905-1921. Completely unexpected discovery.

Wow, that's a great story and find. 

For any of you newcomers to these forums who wonder what some of us mean when we say these forums can improve your coin collecting knowledge or why it pays to spend time here.....this is a GREAT find for anybody interested in Saint-Gaudens Double Eagles specifically or just coin history in general !! 

Edited June 12, 2023 by GoldFinger1969

[GoldFinger1969]

  Congrats to EC:

https://coinweek.com/finest-set-of-saint-gaudens-double-eagles-at-ana-show/

Edited June 12, 2023 by GoldFinger1969

[EliteCollection]

On 6/11/2023 at 9:38 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

  Congrats to EC:

https://coinweek.com/finest-set-of-saint-gaudens-double-eagles-at-ana-show/

Thanks! I hope you can come to the ANA to check it out.

[J P M]

On 6/12/2023 at 2:54 AM, EliteCollection said:

Thanks! I hope you can come to the ANA to check it out.

Wow, it is a,,,,  Amazing set .

[GoldFinger1969]

On 6/12/2023 at 2:54 AM, EliteCollection said:

Thanks! I hope you can come to the ANA to check it out.

Hoping to, family and PT job & job search obligations dictate, unfortunately. 

Says it is insured for $25 MM...if the 1933 is there, that seems kind of low (I get that this is sensitive information and you can't give out details on this).  Your collection IMO (not that you need it  ) is worth well north of that figure.  Hell, include the 1933 DE and you probably are at that $25 MM level with 2 or 3 more coins.

I'm available for a security detail watch with my Red Ryder BB gun if you need me.  

Edited June 12, 2023 by GoldFinger1969

[EliteCollection]

I'm not displaying the 1933 DE this time because it's not part of the PCGS main set and I think this set is impressive enough. Maybe next time!

[GoldFinger1969]

On 6/12/2023 at 4:40 PM, EliteCollection said:

I'm not displaying the 1933 DE this time because it's not part of the PCGS main set and I think this set is impressive enough. Maybe next time!

I commend you for displaying the coins and making them available.  There are lots of other top coins, including some of the MCMVII UHRs and HRs that have not been seen in DECADES and numsimatists, dealers, and the TPGs have actually lost track of them somewhat (assuming they've even been graded). 

I think it's great that the coins you are donating to the exhibit are visible and their provenance continues to be known.  Great job ! 

Edited June 13, 2023 by GoldFinger1969

[GoldFinger1969]

ASG's letter......is that dated "August 11th, 1905" ? 

Looks like they typed "11" with old-fashioned top and bottom lined "II" (I's).

 

[RWB]

On 6/12/2023 at 10:58 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

ASG's letter......is that dated "August 11th, 1905" ? 

Looks like they typed "11" with old-fashioned top and bottom lined "II" (I's).

 

Yes. Typewriters did not have the digit " 1 " on them. Typists used either a capital letter "I" or a lower case "L."

[GoldFinger1969]

On 6/13/2023 at 1:10 PM, RWB said:

Yes. Typewriters did not have the digit " 1 " on them. Typists used either a capital letter "I" or a lower case "L."

That's weird...I didn't know that.....why the heck would they have every other number except the "1" ?

Edited June 15, 2023 by GoldFinger1969

[RWB]

Don't know.

[zadok]

On 6/15/2023 at 12:26 AM, GoldFinger1969 said:

That's weird...I didn't know that.....why the heck would they have every other number except the "1" ?

...conservation of resources n space, earlier manufacturers were frugal n redundancy was not considered a positive....

[Sandon]

On 6/15/2023 at 12:26 AM, GoldFinger1969 said:

That's weird...I didn't know that.....why the heck would they have every other number except the "1" ?

  The manual typewriters on which I first practiced dated from the 1940s or 50s and didn't have a separate key for the "1". You used the lower case "l" (L), which had the upper serif and a horizontal line at the bottom and was considered identical. No one was confused. I've only seen the capital "i" (identical to lower case "L" in this font) used in older typing like this letter. The electric typewriter that I bought in 1981 has a key for the "1", but most experienced typists considered it superfluous and found it easier to use the lower case "L".