Roger Burdette's Saint Gaudens Double Eagles Book
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2,045 posts in this topic

On 6/10/2022 at 10:16 AM, VKurtB said:

“Streetcar Named Desire”?

[A QUESTION FOR VKURTB:  How did she pronounce her last name?

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On 6/10/2022 at 2:05 PM, Quintus Arrius said:

[A QUESTION FOR VKURTB:  How did she pronounce her last name?

...vkurt is taking a nap....ill answer for him......hunter....

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Posted (edited)

Soooo...Curiosity is killing my cat   (shrug)

Eliasburg set at 93.2% complete https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/gold/20-gold-major-sets/st-gaudens-20-gold-major-varieties-1933-patterns-1907/alltimeset/4834

Elite at 94.9% https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/gold/20-gold-major-sets/st-gaudens-20-gold-major-varieties-1933-patterns-1907/360

They are giving Eliasburg credit for the 33 & we know Elite has one. The only other coins are the patterns. (Elite still private for obvious reasons)

See my curiosity?

Possible candidates???

Judd 1776 PR

Judd 1778 PR 

Judd 1778

Judd 1779 PR

Edited by Cat Bath
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On 7/4/2022 at 2:21 AM, Cat Bath said:

Soooo...Curiosity is killing my cat   (shrug)

Eliasburg set at 93.2% complete https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/gold/20-gold-major-sets/st-gaudens-20-gold-major-varieties-1933-patterns-1907/alltimeset/4834

Elite at 94.9% https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/gold/20-gold-major-sets/st-gaudens-20-gold-major-varieties-1933-patterns-1907/360

They are giving Eliasburg credit for the 33 & we know Elite has one. The only other coins are the patterns. (Elite still private for obvious reasons)

See my curiosity?

Possible candidates???

Judd 1776 PR

Judd 1778 PR 

Judd 1778

Judd 1779 PR

...not sure why ur cat is curious?...bout what?...the eliasberg set contained a circulation intended '33 double eagle, later relinguished to the govt...EC currently has the legit one, two diff coins...the set registry doesnt intimate that the eliasberg coin was a pattern?...what exactly is ur cats question?....

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@Cat Bath:

Strictly as an aside, I do see what you are driving at, but I do not have an answer.  My own set, also on the PCGS Set Registry is 100% complete and both the current and all-time finest, highest graded, etc.  But, I am not happy. Why? Because though the plaque I got, and another one I expect I shall receive shortly, reads "Best..."  IT IS NOT.  Better examples, all of which have been formally recognized and can be counted on one hand, lie out there. And God only knows the vast majority remain raw and undetected. [I believe Europeans are both amused and mystified by our reliance on the Sheldon Scale. The French designation, FDC, runs the entire gamut from MS-65 through MS-70.]  I see the light at the end of the tunnel but day-after-day it turned out to be nothing but a mirage. My hopes dashed.

Obviously, I cannot speak for the two gentlemen you speak of, but I suspect they face the same problem I do: unavailability.  At my age, I cannot wait for my Great Snake, as it were, to show up, so I have withdrawn from the hunt. There is nothing more infuriating than to submit Want Lists and issue APB's and BOLO's, only to be bombarded by totally inapplicable alerts and notifications. Every coin collector has experienced this in their own way. 🐓 

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The Elite Collection -- being assembled by a poster here by that name who has contributed nicely to these forums -- will probably add to the top ranking once completed.  In fact, whoever owns the 1933 Saint in the future is almost certain to be ahead of the Eliasberg Collection because if they can afford the 1933 Saint they can certainly afford top-coins in other years/mints.

I'm not a registry guy, so I don't know how much having or not having the 1933 Saint helps/hurts your registry point total.  With only a single 1933 Saint, unless the current or future owner(s) want to sell it, even a billionaire can't get another one (unless/until the others are released). 

Here's a good question:  if you went just for AU-58 coins or low-MS coins before scarcity value hit...excepting the 1933 Saint....how much would it cost to assemble all the Saint-Gaudens DEs ?  Obviously, a fraction of what the top collections are spending but I still think it would be low-7 figures when you add in the 1927-D and a few others.

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Posted (edited)
On 7/4/2022 at 2:21 AM, Cat Bath said:

They are giving Eliasburg credit for the 33 & we know Elite has one. 

You mean they assume he had one (I guess he did for a while) ?  Or they just compute the registry points through the 1932 Saint ?

And why are patterns included -- a bonus ?  They're NOT technically "coins" ?  Only pattern that should count is the 1907 UHR, IMO.....at least it is "related" to the MCMVII HR.  The other patterns have no circulated coins based on their obverse and reverse.

Edited by GoldFinger1969
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Posted (edited)
On 7/4/2022 at 8:01 AM, zadok said:

the eliasberg set contained a circulation intended '33 double eagle, later relinguished to the govt...EC currently has the legit one, two diff coins...the set registry doesnt intimate that the eliasberg coin was a pattern?

It was a 1933 like the current one...."sneaked" out most likely by Israel Switt.  But it wasn't graded and I have seen no description.

Logic would dictate that the coin was uncirculated and probably close in grade to the Elite coin.  The Langbord Ten had one Details coin; all the others were MS-64 and above.

Edited by GoldFinger1969
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On 7/4/2022 at 12:12 PM, Quintus Arrius said:

My own set, also on the PCGS Set Registry is 100% complete and both the current and all-time finest, highest graded, etc. 

Gold Rooster collection, right ?

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On 7/5/2022 at 11:41 AM, GoldFinger1969 said:

...."sneaked" out most likely by Isreal Switt.

No evidence that this is true. Having coin in 1937 doesn't mean he had anything to do with exchange of coins in 1933/34.

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On 7/5/2022 at 11:32 AM, GoldFinger1969 said:

.... if they can afford the 1933 Saint they can certainly afford top-coins in other years/mints.

I'm not a registry guy, ...

[Respectfully, this is a most regrettable, overly-broad conclusion and, not being a set registrant, I don't know if you could identify with those who are.  I am a Virgo; astrological lore has it that we are critical and perfectionists. Plenty of people can manage to snag a rare car or painting, but that alone becomes their claim to fame. What completing my 🐓 set requires, nay demands, is I become a 24/7 fanatic.  Starting fairly late in life, I do not have the luxury of patience to wait for coins to appear: I decided to get them at any cost. I believe the woman who "bribed" those who owned the three coins I "required," shortly thereafter lost her job. And for me, hewing to the MS-67 line proved futile: to date (last I checked) not a single one of the coins which comprise fully half the original 🐓 series, has yet to be submitted, authenticated and certified with an MS-67 designation. So, in my eyes, I am a loser, while the rest of the numismatic community showers me with accolades and plaques. Truth be told:  I was simply at the right time, at the right place and well-positioned to act decisively. I know, I know...

BACK ON TRACK!  xD

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On 7/5/2022 at 4:32 PM, Nutmeg Coin said:

Thanks for RWB's many contributions to the hobby, too bad he is not on the CU forums anymore to share his wisdom.

I am on CU but rarely visit unless someone asks a question. I was banned from PCGS for being truthful and honest about incorrect attributions.

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On 7/5/2022 at 3:41 PM, RWB said:

No evidence that this is true. Having coin in 1937 doesn't mean he had anything to do with exchange of coins in 1933/34.

True, I'm just going by the most likely or most popular narrative.  :)

Also, we still don't know (and probably will never) if it was taken out in 1933/34 or 1937.  We can speculate if Izzy told his daughter Joan before he passed on.  Judging by the posts by Roy Langbord, he does not have any "smoking gun" to answer the question of how his grandfather got the coins.

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On 7/5/2022 at 4:32 PM, Nutmeg Coin said:

Thanks for RWB's many contributions to the hobby, too bad he is not on the CU forums anymore to share his wisdom.

Their loss is our gain.  They not only treated long-time veterans who spent thousands of dollars with PCGS shabbily -- like newcomer trolls -- they also deleted valuable threads like the Joe Bonano Omega High Relief.

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On 7/5/2022 at 8:14 PM, Nutmeg Coin said:

They gave me a warning when I suggested that members could go over the head of PCGS to either a numismatic or governmental entity on some of their arbitrary actions.

You mean for forum posts....or grades/labels on coins ?

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Posted (edited)
On 7/5/2022 at 8:26 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

You mean for forum posts....or grades/labels on coins ?

It was a while back, something major, not posts. I suggested that if collectors on the CU forums found that PCGS was doing something against numismatic rules they could take it up with the PNG or consumer agency.

Edited by Nutmeg Coin
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On 7/5/2022 at 8:47 PM, Nutmeg Coin said:

It was a while back, something major, not posts.

Without paying attention to the specifics, criticism should certainly be allowed.  I'm not sure if bringing in the government to evaluate hobby standards is wise.  They have better things to do and we can self-police through the market.

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On 7/5/2022 at 7:40 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

most likely

Actually unlikely. He does not appear on Mint accounts at any time the coins were hanging out there.

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On 7/5/2022 at 7:43 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

Their loss is our gain.  They not only treated long-time veterans who spent thousands of dollars with PCGS shabbily -- like newcomer trolls -- they also deleted valuable threads like the Joe Bonano Omega High Relief.

Joe Bananas! I read his autobiography: A Man of Honor... What's that?  Not the same Joe Bonanno? Oh, sorry... disregard. doh! (Seriously, I'm glad I kept my mouth shut on other forums; here is where I belong.)

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On 7/5/2022 at 10:11 PM, Quintus Arrius said:

Joe Bananas! I read his autobiography: A Man of Honor... What's that?  Not the same Joe Bonanno? Oh, sorry... disregard. doh! (Seriously, I'm glad I kept my mouth shut on other forums; here is where I belong.)

...the votes not in yet, there may need to be a recount, but i hear the mail in ballots r trending in ur favor....

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On 7/5/2022 at 9:56 PM, RWB said:

Actually unlikely. He does not appear on Mint accounts at any time the coins were hanging out there.

You know I agree with you on the HARD EVIDENCE not being there.  It's mostly circumstantial that I am referring to.

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