PVC Damage to Indian Heads and Flying Eagles

[coppertop-migration]

A few of my indian head cents and some flying eagle cents were stored (before I got ahold of them) in PVC for about 4 year. There is only a very slight indication of PVC residue.

 

I have read on the net and heard from dealers that a 2 second dunk in acetone will neutralize the PVC film.

 

I know you should never clean or tamper with your coins except in the case of PVC contact.

 

My question is, are there any special precautions or procedures when dealing with copper or the copper-nickel combination used in the flying eagles. I know copper is a very delicate coin material.

 

I don't want to mess up, but need to address the issue. Thanks.

[gmarguli]

I'm not sure if 2 seconds in acetone will do it. It might take a soak for a couple of minutes. You can use a Q-Tip if you like.

 

If they are expensive coins you may want to let NCS do the work for you.

[coppertop-migration]

I read a lot about "dipping" and its evils. Is putting a coin into acetone for a short period of time to remove the effects of PVC considered "dipping"?

 

Will using a wet Q-tip of acetone on a cent scratch the surface of the coin or leave any permanent scratches or marks?

 

Most of the coins are not masterpieces, although a few of the 1857 and 1858 flying eagle cents are in the AU category. Maybe I'll have NCS clean those...

 

I don't want to effect the toning of the coins. I think I read that it takes a very long time in acetone before the toning will be effected. Is this true?

 

As always, thanks for the great info....

[BankNote1]

If they are Unc or Proof I would be light on the Qtip but acetone wont do any harm to the coins , that I know of, and will remove the PVC.

[gmarguli]

I read a lot about "dipping" and its evils. Is putting a coin into acetone for a short period of time to remove the effects of PVC considered "dipping"?

 

No, it is not considered dipping. Dipping = dipped in acid.

 

 

Will using a wet Q-tip of acetone on a cent scratch the surface of the coin or leave any permanent scratches or marks?

 

Not if you do it properly.

 

 

I don't want to effect the toning of the coins. I think I read that it takes a very long time in acetone before the toning will be effected. Is this true?

 

No. Acetone can have an immediate affect on the toning. Usually it doesn't change it, but it can.

[coppertop-migration]

My only fear is that using a Q-tip with Acetone on it would keep a coin from being graded. Will it fade the copper?

 

So I assume this is note considered "dipping".

[BankNote1]

There is no way anyone could ever detect that a coin was dipped or rinsed with acetone. It is a solvent that drys clear and doesn't leave a residue. Every raw coin I buy gets a dip in acetone and I have never had a coin come back from NGC BB'ed for acetone!!

[gmarguli]

My only fear is that using a Q-tip with Acetone on it would keep a coin from being graded.

 

Not if done properly. Get the tip soaked in acetone and LIGHTLY move it over the surfaces. If you rub the coin with it, you will kill the coin. Keep changing the Q-Tip as the acetone evaporates very quickly and you don't want a dry Q-Tip touching the coin. Use a new Q-Tip, do not reuse an old one.

 

 

Will it fade the copper?

 

No.

 

 

So I assume this is note considered "dipping".

 

Correct.

[coppertop-migration]

Thanks to everyone. I will relax now and carefully remove the PVC redidue. The damage is very light, so I am optimistic that the coins will be fine.

[coppertop-migration]

Here's a picture of one of the coins after the PVC removal (there was not much there)

 

How did I do?

[TomB]

The coin looks like a nice coin, probably a high end AU, though I cannot tell for sure from the image.

 

The information you have obtained thus far has been excellent. The only thing I might add is that not all green residue on coins, especially copper, is PVC. There appear to be green spots next to the wreath on the right side of the reverse, these might be verdigris. Verdigris is a disease of copper and acetone will generally leave it alone. If verdigris is deep and then removed it will leave pitting scars where it had been.

 

You may use acetone on any coin, but I would be wary of doing much "touch up" work of significantly worn pieces as these may show the tell tale signs of the work performed. If you have a lower grade coin that you are looking to have helped by use of acetone then you may be better off leaving it in a small dish of acetone to soak.

 

Lastly, as mentioned acetone evaporates quickly. This is good and bad. It is bad in that it is highly flammable and also can damage your lungs, liver and kidneys if you breathe high concentrations of it in a closed environment. It is also bad in that if you do not rinse the coin quickly with cool water, or give it another rinse in clean acetone then you will end up with a fine layer of dried residue on the coin that can cause it to tone poorly or to get bagged.

[coppertop-migration]

TomB, I have a follow-up question to your post about Acetone. If I simply dip a coin in Acetone for 2 seconds, do I need to rinse with water? I asked a local coin dealer if I needed to dunk a coin distilled water after a 2 second dunk in acetone and he said I did not. I did this to some of my coins but did not then rinse them due to the short period of time. I have also read that people then dunk the coin in ethyl alcohol.

 

I also wonder what I should do on the attached coin, since I took a Q-tip on the coin and lightly dabbed for a short-while on each side of the coin. I was very liberal in my use wet Q-tips (I kept getting new ones the second it looked like it got debris on it). I did not however then rinse in water. Am I going to have problems with this coin now? Do I need to go back and retreat? Or should I just leave it alone? I may submit this coin, and I want to take care of it properly for future generations.

 

Thanks.

[TomB]

I probably should not have included the part about cool water since I really don't think it makes any difference if you use water at all after an acetone rinse. Sorry for the unnecessary inclusion.

 

The only problem you may have if you don't rinse the coin in clean acetone after you finish getting any PVC off is that you may leave a thin film residue of PVC on the coin. What happens is that the highly concentrated spots of PVC dissolve off of the coin and into the acetone, however, if the coin is dipped in the acetone then it is basically sitting in a weak PVC stew. By pulling the coin out, and not rinsing again with clean acetone, you allow for the possible contamination of the general surfaces of the coin by the PVC stew.

 

In my opinion, if you use acetone to get the PVC off and then rinse with clean acetone you should be fine.

 

Sadly, many dealers simply don't care if a coin has a thin layer of PVC remaining because they know they will hold the coin for only a very brief period of time and if it turns it is likely to turn while someone else owns it.

[BankNote1]

Stay away from the water! Like tom says rinse in clean acetone!

[coppertop-migration]

OK, one last question. Is there an easy way to tell the difference between verdigris and PVC green slime? Since these pennies were exposed to PVC for a while and also contain some verdigris, it would be nice to know what needs to be removed (PVC plasticiser) vs. what doesn't (verdigris).

 

Thanks.

[Oldtrader3]

PVC Plasticizer is normally a chemical like zinc stearate. It is not PVC. Verdigris is Cu(OH)2+H2O) and is a by product of chlorine gas emitted by the PVC.