I got the new Heritage Catalog...

[jtryka]

...and it was the thinnest I've seen in a while! This one is for the Charlotte ANA show, and as far as Saints go, it was pretty weak (there is likely a lot for collectors of other series though). There were maybe a half dozen or so better date pieces, beside the usual plethora of 1907 HRs, and none of them screamed WOW! Is this just a sign of the complete lack of material for sale, or is this a sign of a broader market softening? Any thoughts?

[lazeroo]

looks like there just running out of large collections to sell.

 

they definitly are looking for stuff to sell , with lots of insentives.

you think it's time to dump some stuff yet ?

 

nahhh! I think i'll wait a little longer.

your right jtryka there's so many HR gaudens out there you would think there still making them .

[EVillageProwler]

I think part of the reason is that the mid-winter ANA show isn't really that well attended... At least the last few haven't been...

 

Did anyone notice Sunnywood's coins in there?

 

EVP

 

[BankNote1]

I talked with someone at heritage and they said that they had sold over 10 tons of coins last year!! I don't know if that includes the plastic or not.

[Sunnywood]

Why thanks EVP, I noticed them myself !!

 

Heritage limited this sale to 2000 lots as they probably felt the Charlotte show would not support a larger auction. So the catalog is not as replete as Long Beach, but there are plenty of good coins in there.

 

I was disappointed though, as they promised me that my spectacular rainbow-toned 1866 Rays proof shield nickel NGC PF67 CAM would be on the cover, but it didn't happen. And their photos of the coin do not capture the amazing colors. Oh well. The 1868, 1876 and 1877 are pretty cool too. Hopefully the folks who see these coins in person will bid them up with appropriate enthusiasm

 

Sunnywood

 

 

[keithdagen]

Sunnywood,

 

I haven't got the catalog yet. Can you let me know which coins you are referring to? I'll probably drive over to Heritage in the next several days and start doing some lot viewing. I'd like to see some of the coins you've mentioned.

[Sunnywood]

Hi Keith,

 

It would be very cool if you went & looked at some of my coins in person !!!! Then you could post here with your honest opinions of the coins.

 

There is a spectacular 1877 minor proof set (1c - 3c - 5c) in matched, consecutively numbered NGC holders, which is being broken up & offered as three separate lots:

 

The 1c is NGC PF66 RB Lot # 5168

The 3CN is NGC PF67 Lot # 5319

The 5c is NGC PF67 Lot # 5357

 

All three coins have beautiful original multi-color toning and decent mirrors. They would probably CAM if dipped, but I don't believe in that (and when you see the colors, you'll agree).

 

The best coin is the 1866 Rays proof NGC PF67 CAM with stellar rainbow peripheral colors, destined for the finest rainbow proof type set. That one is lot # 5342. Also take a look at the finest known 1868 proof nickel, lot # 5345.

 

Some other pretty coins are the 1876 proof nickel lot # 5354, the 1910 lib nickel lot # 5381, and a gorgeous 1877 proof twenty cents PCGS PR65 CAM Lot # 5672.

 

I hope you enjoy them, especially my favorite, the 1866 Rays proof nickel # 5342. Although Heritage did do a nice job of describing it, the coin actually has even more colors than what they said. Anyone who sees it in person will love it !!!

 

Best,

Sunnywood

 

[jtryka]

Sunnywood,

 

I read the blub about your collection, as always quite impressive. I only wish they had a separate listing of just the lots from each collection they are selling. One thing they mentioned was your 1877 proof set, and something about not including the half union patterns. What is a half union? I've never heard of them before, and was wondering if you could expand a little. Thanks!

[EVillageProwler]

half union is a $50 piece.

 

evp

 

[keithdagen]

Jeff,

 

Go to the auctions main page and you'll see featured collections. Click on it and it will only bring up Sunnywood's lots. I'm going to view them this afternoon, so by Monday or Tuesday, I'll try to get some impressions up.

[Sunnywood]

Back before the days of electronic transfers, banks moved money back and forth between them with bags of coin and currency. There were many times in our nation's history when the paper currency was less respected than hard metal specie, so bags of gold coins (usually double eagles) did double duty: they provided circulating coinage for the pockets of the well-to-do, but they also provided units of exchange between banks.

 

It was really for these banking transactions that two larger denominations of gold coinage were contemplated. In keeping with a decimal-based money system, our basic denomination was the dollar. Ten dollars was an "eagle," and ten eagles would be a "union," in honor of the union of (then quite a few less than fifty) states.

 

Just as there was a "quarter eagle," a "half eagle," and a "double eagle," it was contemplated that there would be a "half union" ($50) and a "union" ($100) gold coin. In 1877, two designs for a half union were struck bearing that date. Each was struck in a unique gold copy (both are now in the Smithsonian), as well as several copper copies, some of which were gilt. One of these copper half union patterns is up for sale in the Bowers Baltimore auction: Link to half union pattern !!

 

Interestingly, these two unique pattern gold coins played a crucial role in pattern collecting today. When it was discovered by Mint officials that Woodin had procured these two patterns from the Mint foir his private collection, the Mint insisted on their return to the National Cabinet (which used to be beautifully displayed in the Smithsonian - the current display in the Smithsonian is a disgrace). The Mint traded Woodin an entire TRUNK FULL of patterns, many of which had never been seen before outside the Mint. This led to the cataloguing by Adams & Woodin which became the first reference on patterns. Many of the 19th century patterns in collections today started out in that trunk !!!!

 

Sunnywood

 

[Hoot]

Sunnywood! - I looked at the coins that are posted on Heritage: The Sunnywood Collection, Part 1. It has taken me several hours to recover from the involuntary physical reactions, one after another!

 

Your coins are nothing shy of spectacular. I hope that you will write the history of the coins in your family, as the Heritage blurb (see the web site) intrigued me.

 

You are one fascinating character.

 

Hoot

[coinman1794]

I'm pretty sure they set a limit on the number of lots for this auction and that's why it is smaller. I was asked to consigne and they said it was limited to a certain number of lots. It was a more exclusive auction, rather than a shortage of coins, that created the smaller catologue.

[keithdagen]

The ANA limits the number of lots in the auction. That was explained to me today.

 

OK, I will say that Sunnywood had a great eye and that his coins were very attractive, without exception, and very nice for the assigned grades. I shall not say anymore, because I found a few that I am considering bidding on, and don't want to give away anymore detail than that. If you are a purchaser of these coins, you won't be disappointed.

[EVillageProwler]

I will say that Sunnywood had a great eye

 

Yeah, he did. But, he had to get rid of it when he decided to enter into a business relationship with WallStreetMan...

 

Sunnywood actually has one good eye left, but he needs that for his family and his dog.

 

If you see a pleasant, average-looking white guy approaching his midling years with an eye patch -- that's Sunnywood!

 

 

EVP

 

[jtryka]

So how is ol' WSM? I can just picture him with his head stuck in the 9th hole at his local par-3 course! As for shortage of material, I got another strange one from Heritage today, some sort of fake check for $1,000 that is good if I sign up for some survey and then consign at least $50,000 in future auctions. Not sure why they want to make it like a game show, though I suppose they are just looking to enhance their database of potential customers. Seems kinda cheesy if you ask me. Maybe that's just because I am a net buyer right now, so I'd much rather spend the $1,000 on coins today! Of course it is a small concession compared with the $7,500 in seller's fees they would charge on a $50,000 collection.

[EVillageProwler]

I threw the "check" out...

 

EVP

 

[Sunnywood]

Keith - thanks for the kind words about my coins I'm glad you enjoyed looking at them as much as I have !! Good luck on your bidding.

 

EVP - In addition to the one eye, I have another in the back of my head - that one has 20/20 hindsight !! Approaching middle years, yes, guilty as charged. Average looking? Well, I don't know, my dog certainly likes me !! (Though perhaps not in the same way as your dog likes you, from what I hear ... )

 

Mark - My mother & my uncle (her brother) were both interested in coins, while their first cousin had a first-rate stamp collection. My uncle had a complete MS set of Indian $2.50 and $5.00, although probably in lower MS grades (those coins are REALLY REALLY difficult to grade, and that was before the days of slabs). That gave me the idea 30-40 years later to assemble the finest set of Indian $2.50 (now reduced to #2 on the PCGS Registry, oh well). I got about half-way through the Indian $5.00 too, but as I prefer finest certified coins, that series rapidly got too expensive !!!!

 

My mom actually started collecting Morgans, with the idea of giving them to her kids someday. Then it branched out into a US type set. Of course these were not super high-grade specimens, many were XF-AU. Meanwhile my uncle got into early coppers and especially the 1793 & 1794 large cents by Sheldon variety. Later he sold the Indians and my mom sold the Morgans, and they jointly put together a bunch of MS year sets from the 1860's and 1870's. (Not every year, just some selected years.) By then I was nine or ten, and I got hooked. My uncle dropped out of coins after he got burned on a business deal and needed the $$ to clean up the mess !! But my mom put all the coins in a safety deposit box. Not a lot of high-grade stuff, but really cool nonetheless.

 

My first two coins were an 1878 8TF Morgan and an 1883 shield, both from Stack's and graded "Gem BU." The 8TF Morgan would be called DMPL today, and was dead perfect save for one bagmark across the cheek. I sold it for $100 when I was 16. (AAAARRRRGGGGHHHHHH!!!!!) From what I remember, it's a $4000 + coin today. The 1883 shield inspired me to assemble the finest shield collection of all time ... at one point I had virtually cornered the market in finest certified MS shields from 1867 through 1879. I have long since dispersed many of those coins. The last of the great proofs are up in the Charlotte Sale. However, I am still working on a set of MS Cherrypicker variety shield nickels. I feel these are under-appreciated and under-valued. They will have their day !!

 

I got burned by dealers as a kid (from age 9 through 16, I was collecting extensively), and sold most everything at age 16. But, I picked it up again 5 years ago. Now I am "cleaning house" and thinking about what I will collect next, but there will probably be a hiatus before I start again. It's just so much of a racket, with slabs, crossovers, doctors, dealers, hustling wholesalers, AT coins, etc etc etc ... and what really alarmed me was how quickly pops could climb even in classic series, once the bids started moving up. It seems like some people can just "make" as many coins as they want. I think next time around I will go for coins with true absolute rarity ... you just can't make that many 1802 half dimes even if you own a grading service !!!!

 

Oh my, I am rambling on at length again, as usual ....

 

Sunnywood

 

 

[Hoot]

Sunnywood! I love the ramble! Don't ever think these boards can use less of what you have to say! You truly have the depth of experience to speak of with coins. You, EVP, TDN, Keith, Jeff, Greg, Michael, Darin, GDJSMP, Chris, Arch and all the NGC crew and many others - no one the less!!! - have MANY good things to say!!! I always enjoy the fun and the wisdom!

 

Hoot

[EVillageProwler]

So how is ol' WSM? I can just picture him with his head stuck in the 9th hole at his local par-3 course!

 

Jeff,

 

Picture this: WSM with his head in the 9th hole and his hind section up in the air. A golfer drives one from afar and hits the 9th hole -- only it's not the right hole!

 

 

EVP

 

[EVillageProwler]

Mark - It's not what we have to say, but how prominent are our physical reactions!

 

Sunnywood - It's not so much that my dog likes me in that "special" way, but that I like her in that way...

 

!

 

EVP

 

[jtryka]

Oh my! You're in a feisty mood this morning EVP!

[BankNote1]

Speaking of the Heritage Catalog. Did anyone see the MS68 Monroe Comem?

[BOILER78]

I love the contest where the winner can consign 100k worth of coins at zero comission. I guarantee if you have 100k worth of coins to consign they will pay you a comission and you don't have to fill out a survey to qualify.

[gmarguli]

For the last few auctions, they have sent me a coupon with the coins telling me that I can auction off the ONE coin listed (always the most expensive one I purchased at that auction) for no commission. That's so sweet.

[Chippewa]

Was going to toss my $1,000 "check". However, it looks like if you sold $50,000 through Heritage cumulatively, you could get the $1,000 on top of whatever other deal you could cut.

 

That raises an interesting question. I have always assumed that big consignors do not pay any sellers fee and have suspected that some of the 15% goes to them as well. DOes anyone know what the "real" auction fee schedule is for large and valuable collections?

 

I looked at the Heritage pictures of the MS-68 Monroe. That coin is double-bagger ugly. It may have the technical grade and strike of a 68 but it has the eye appeal of a bargain bin coin. What were you thinking on that one, NGC?

[BOILER78]

I have consigned coins several times and have never paid a sellers fee. I have received anywhere from 102%-105% of the hammer price each time. I don't know the magic number on the consignment value before you actually receive a comission on your coins but I am sure that is also negotiable.

 

I did not realize that the auction companies would actively compete for consignments until a friend sold a major collection and explained the process to me.

 

You can also negotiate buy back fees to save $ on coins that you wish to protect with reserves.

[Chippewa]

Thanks for the information. That confirms my suspicions. Based on the fact that Heritage calls every time they have an auction coming up I figured the coin acquisition business was very competitive.

[keithdagen]

I looked at the Heritage pictures of the MS-68 Monroe.

 

The Heritage pictures on this auction were brutal. I looked at over 40 coins, and almost all of them were brighter or more colorful than their pics indicated.

 

I can say that in almost every instance, if the coin has both a scan and an enhanced pic, the scan shows more color than the pic will, and the pics are pretty washed out.