How to tell if a Trade Dollar is fake

[carp1333-migration]

When my father died i got the coin collection he and I put together when i was a kid. Of the coins in there the only 2 I was unsure of was a trade dollar and 1922 wheat penny. I know a large number of fakes exists for both and was going to submit for grading but want to see if anyone knew of an easier way of determining if they are fakes before i wasted my money. Any help would be appreciated.

 

Carp1333

useropie1333@cs.com

[reid1836]

As to the trade dollar, you may want to look for raised bumps of metal on the coin and what may appear as file marks around the rims edge. These are some of the diagnostics of a fake trade dollar. For the cent,first look at the mint mark area to see if there are any signs of disturbance. Such as file marks or scratches that a sand paper might make. This would be from the mint mark being altered or removed. The 22 Lincoln cent has three varieties that I am aware of for the 22 no-D or 22 plain. There is a weak D variety in which the mint mark appears only slightly . There is a no-D weak reverse variety where the reverse details appear mushy, that is to say that the inner details of the reverse design for the most part do not show and blend together to give it a "mushy" appearance. Third and most popular as well as valuable is the no-D with a strong reverse. The diagnostics for a genuine piece are probably easier to discern than those for a fake. First look at the obverse, at the motto "In God We Trust" the first three words have the "mushy " effect with the last word appearing stronger than the rest. Second, the in the word Liberty , the R seems to touch the left cross bar of the T. Also word appears to enlarge as it goes from left to right giving it somewhat of a cone effect. Third the date appears weak and mushy in the first three digits and is stronger on the last digit. Last, Lincolns coat. The right bottom corner of which seems to fade out and is not complete. The reverse details are strong, that is to say the inner design details show some prominence even on well worn specimens.

Hope this helps !

[Tradedollarnut]

The number one test for a fake is the wrong reverse type for the year minted. From 1873-76 the eagle had a berry under his claw. For 1875-1885, there was no berry. Often times you'll find a fake with no berry 1873 or 1874, or one with a berry 1877-1885.

 

Second most obvious test is that the numerals of the date should be exactly the same size. Many fakes have the last digit oversized.

 

Moving on to the more subtle features, the 0's in 900 and 420 should be perfectly oval with thick sides and narrow tops and bottoms. In most cases, there should be a period after FINE and DOLLAR.

 

The rims should be continuous with well formed denticles. Many fakes have mushy denticles and incomplete rims.

 

If your coin meets all these tests, then it is either a decent fake or genuine. Post a picture or take it to a dealer for verification.

[braddick]

The easiest for me, without even having to study the coin, at first, is weight.

I have yet to find a counterfeit Trade dollar that was the proper and correct weight.

[Merc]

Randy of ANACS wrote about fake trade dollars in the FUN topics magazine. There are good die struck counterfeits being made now. They have the correct weight, diameter, and silver content. All the lettering is of the correct size and type. Real coins must have been used for the making of the counterfeit dies. They can identify the fakes by looking for little imperfections that were on the counterfeit die causing all the the fake coins to have the same imperfections.

[Elcontador]

IMO, the only way to separate a good fake from a genuine Trade $ is to send it in for grading. Most fakes I've seen were when I was in Southeast Asia, and almost all of them were obvious fakes. Diameter was wrong, obviously incorrect weight, poor quality copies etc. All of them were 1875 S, oddly enough.

 

However, when I was in Vietnam, I found an 1875 CC. It looked good & I bought it.

Right diameter, right weight, crisp details. Though it had a lot of contact marks, it looked genuine. I took it to Long Beach and it also fooled most dealers who saw it.

 

One guy got it right. He took it out of the holder & bounced it on the table. The silver content wasn't quite right, as it didn't have the right 'ping' sound. The coin had so many contact marks, that I didn't mind the guy bouncing it on the table.

He was so impressed by the quality of the fake, that he bought it from me.

[James_OldeTowne]

Braddick, it would be very risky to rely on weight alone! There are many fakes that are of the proper weight and even silver content - not the cheap Chinese fakes, but rather good-quality die-struck fakes.

 

Of course, there are also added mintmarks, particularly CCs, and removed mintmarks, like the 1878-S. These are very deceptive fakes that conform in all other regards to genuine coins since they started out as genuine!

 

If there's any doubt at all, better get it certified.

 

James

[braddick]

James, I don't rely on it exclusively. In fact, I made sure to state, it's the first thing I check. Bottom line, if the weight it off there is no need to check further, it's a counterfeit. Very few (none I've seen) fakes are of the proper weight (the weight of the Trade dollar, not the Morgan!).

[carp1333-migration]

Everyone thanks for your help I think mines a fake because the 3 in 1873 s oersized.

[Jimmy The Ratt-migration]

I just paid three euros for about fifty of these coins. very nice work really. mostly 1875 cc but there was one "minted"in 1847.

[bsshog40]

James, I don't rely on it exclusively. In fact, I made sure to state, it's the first thing I check. Bottom line, if the weight it off there is no need to check further, it's a counterfeit. Very few (none I've seen) fakes are of the proper weight (the weight of the Trade dollar, not the Morgan!).

 

I have a fake trade that was very close to weight. The forum helped me to distinguish this as a fake from the weak struck areas that should not have been. Just thought I'd this.

[stev32k]

One characteristic of about 99% of counterfeits that has not been mentioned is the obverse / reverse orientation. On genuine U.S. coins the up-side for the obverse and reverse are 180 degrees apart. I've only seen the correct orientation on 2 of over 200 fakes I've examined. The others all had the heads and tails anywhere from 0 to about 10 degrees apart. The problem here is that you have to have the coin in hand to tell the difference.

[Allan Ong]

Aren't trade dollars silver? If so, then won't the first test be the ring test?

[rrantique]

Aren't trade dollars silver? If so, then won't the first test be the ring test?

 

Just make a trip to China and see if those over there match yours

 

Just couldn't resist

[bsshog40]

Aren't trade dollars silver? If so, then won't the first test be the ring test?

 

I would think that silver is resourceful enough to put enough silver in a counterfiet to give the proper ring sound. If someone had a decent counterfiet to pass off, then I wouldn't think that $12 worth of silver would be very much of a cost to them if they can con someone out of $300 for the coin.

[Allan Ong]

Aren't trade dollars silver? If so, then won't the first test be the ring test?

 

I would think that silver is resourceful enough to put enough silver in a counterfiet to give the proper ring sound. If someone had a decent counterfiet to pass off, then I wouldn't think that $12 worth of silver would be very much of a cost to them if they can con someone out of $300 for the coin.

 

True... good point.

[MorganMan]

IMO, the only way to separate a good fake from a genuine Trade $ is to send it in for grading. Most fakes I've seen were when I was in Southeast Asia, and almost all of them were obvious fakes. Diameter was wrong, obviously incorrect weight, poor quality copies etc. All of them were 1875 S, oddly enough.

 

However, when I was in Vietnam, I found an 1875 CC. It looked good & I bought it.

Right diameter, right weight, crisp details. Though it had a lot of contact marks, it looked genuine. I took it to Long Beach and it also fooled most dealers who saw it.

 

One guy got it right. He took it out of the holder & bounced it on the table. The silver content wasn't quite right, as it didn't have the right 'ping' sound. The coin had so many contact marks, that I didn't mind the guy bouncing it on the table.

He was so impressed by the quality of the fake, that he bought it from me.

 

 

Are you SURE it was a fake then?

 

MM