Post a provocative, but honest eBay listing, get BUSTED on the PCGS forum?!?!

[James_OldeTowne]

Check THIS out!

 

Just got back from traveling this holiday - I've been out of town for basically two weeks, and haven't even touched a computer keyboard in that time. But it looks like an eBay auction that I scheduled before leaving stirred up a bit of controversy.... see what you think!

 

James

[EVillageProwler]

Best to let sleeping dogs lie. The Internet, of which eBay and the forums are a part, is a cabal writ large.

 

EVP

[ArtR]

James I believe I would have left the following out of the coins description.

I am certain that this coin could be cracked out, and with a little toning applied, it could be slabbed by PCGS or NGC.

[chinook]

I saw that discussion. For those that do not know you or your sense of humor it may have come across with wrong intentions. I really believe a lot of people do not like to hear the truth when it infringes upon their passions.

 

BTW--I stood up for you over there as did Dennis. They then proceded to lynch him.

 

I also would bet that a PCGS forum member bought that coin.

[HaydenTubbs]

James I believe I would have left the following out of the coins description.

I am certain that this coin could be cracked out, and with a little toning applied, it could be slabbed by PCGS or NGC.

Why do you think he got kicked off the CU boards?

The truth often hurts.

BTW I'm sorry I missed out on this one as I've learned through both buying and selling to/from you that your a great guy to deal with,and I wish I had the chance to stick up for you.Some people just can't take humor.

[michael]

you where straight up with what you had and what you said about the coin if anything i respect the description as in my opinion you gave your honest opinion and coins and coin grading is a subjective opinion at best

 

unfortunately the truth hurts and no one wants to hear the truth

 

the coin sold for what it was worth not for a strong premium over the price it was worth so what is the big deal?????

 

many are mad as they TRY TO DO what you said in your description all the time so no one likes to get their hand caught in the pickle jar or have the real story come out taker a look at an AT anx morgan dollar bought for a hundred dollars on ebay broken out of the holder with a false description proven by the fact that the coin was priced at 50 80 100 times its original cost

 

which is okie just do not say how wonderful and great it is AND BREAK IT OUT OF THE HOLDER AND OFFER IT AT 100 TIMES ITS ORIGINAL COST IT MIGHT BNE TECHNICALLY LEGAL BUT NOT ETHICAL OR MORAL IN MY OPINION

 

 

at least you left the coin in the ntc holder and said straight up WHAT EVERYBODY IS THINKING BUT NO ONE WILL EVER SAY IN PRINT

 

 

michael

[Tradedollarnut]

Hmmm - slab a cleaned and hairlined Morgan dollar? I think not.

[James_OldeTowne]

Tradedollarnut (and others),

 

Based on a couple of responses and eMails, a crucial point that is being missed by a few folks is that the coin is lightly cleaned, not drastically hairlined or whizzed, as some are inaccurately stating. In this, as stated in the auction listing, the NTC grade + description were right on. (In fact, given their reputation, the description as shown on the NTC slab is surprisingly accurate for a scarcer coin, but that's beside the point.) If the coin were harshly cleaned, I would not have claimed it could be doctored and put into a PCGS or NGC slab.

 

To make my point another way, is this next statement true or false?

"Doctored coins never get certified by PCGS and NGC"

 

I claim that the cleaning on the NTC coin is so light that it could have a bit of toning applied to subdue the effects, and that it might then get certified by either PCGS or NGC. So much do I believe this that I have asked the high bidder if he'd be interested in selling the coin back to me at a small profit so that I could test my theory. I'll let you know what he replies.

 

James

[Tradedollarnut]

There's a difference between knowingly slabbing a lightly cleaned bust or flowing hair [perhaps even seated] coin and a Morgan. Morgans are so common and bag fresh that the services simply won't forgive a light cleaning like they will on an earlier coin. And if NTC can detect it, you can bet that NGC and PCGS can detect it as well.

 

I'll bet you a cup of coffee that coin never slabs at either PCGS or NGC.

[EVillageProwler]

I agree with TDN.

 

The notion that lightly cleaned or wiped coins get slabbed by the Big 2 is accurate in general. But, if you examine this further and break it down into various series, type of manufacture and grade levels, then the above generality will not be valid 100% of the time.

 

Let's take a look at an exaggerated example with a 2004 MS Lincoln cent. If it were lightly cleaned or wiped, do you think either of the Big 2 will slab it? Compare that with an 1794 dollar that is otherwise unrepaired and undamaged...

 

My 2 examples are extremes of each other, but they serve as a starting point for why a generalization remains a generalization.

 

EVP

[James_OldeTowne]

(((Let's take a look at an exaggerated example with a 2004 MS Lincoln cent. If it were lightly cleaned or wiped, do you think either of the Big 2 will slab it? Compare that with an 1794 dollar that is otherwise unrepaired and undamaged...)))

 

I can't necessarily answer for sure about the "Big 2", though I really do think the answer is "possibly, yes". Now had you said "Big 3", I'd have definitely said "Yes". Recently, I sold a 1964 Washington quarter in this auction that is lightly wiped, yet graded MS-62 by ANACS (no net-grade).

 

Unfortunately, the high-bidder on the NTC coin has declined my offer, so I have no way to answer the looming question....

 

James