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GTG - 1921 Peace $ Grade Posted --

55 posts in this topic

 

I will take the sight-seen opinion of NGC, CAC or PCGS over image-based grade guesses, just about any time. That said, it doesn't mean I will necessarily like the coin.

 

You're not saying that PCGS and CAC are infallible though are you ?

 

Of course not - not even close. Furthermore, Michael, I don't understand why you'd ask that, when I had compared their sight-seen opinion to opinions based just upon images. :devil:

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I will take the sight-seen opinion of NGC, CAC or PCGS over image-based grade guesses, just about any time. That said, it doesn't mean I will necessarily like the coin.

 

You're not saying that PCGS and CAC are infallible though are you ?

 

OH PLEASE NOT AGAIN

 

pp4_can_of_worms_zps59340955.gif

 

:popcorn:

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You have to accept the grader's opinion regarding the state of preservation - but the coin is below average in detail and unattractive to me. Most of the MS-64-66 that I've seen are also flat and lifeless. Ab sense of marks does not mean it is a "gem."

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You have to accept the grader's opinion regarding the state of preservation - but the coin is below average in detail and unattractive to me. Most of the MS-64-66 that I've seen are also flat and lifeless. Ab sense of marks does not mean it is a "gem."

 

+1

 

MJ

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Toner – do you have this coin in hand or are you using the picture from EBAY ??

If it’s the latter I would think the Ebay picture does not even come close to portraying what the coin really looks like.

 

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Toner – do you have this coin in hand or are you using the picture from EBAY ??

If it’s the latter I would think the Ebay picture does not even come close to portraying what the coin really looks like.

 

I believe the images are poor. Being as it's a 1921 Peace S$1 I can feature the MS64 grade, the CAC approval indicates (to me) that the eye appeal/luster must be good and those images don't reflect good luster or eye appeal for a MS64.

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The grade doesn't surprise me much. The photos provided are abysmal and do a great disservice to the poor chap trying to sell it. I suspect a good photographer could bring out the qualities that the grader's saw. That said, I don't disagree that it probably isn't the nicest or most appealing MS64 in existence. It would be interesting to see in-hand.

 

I once owned a MS63 CAC 1927-S Peace dollar that had a very similar look. I could show you photos that made it look like a circulated piece of junk or others that really brought out the luster and made it pop........ was still pretty hard to sell. That's the coin that taught me that not every coin sheathed in certain plastic and green beans was one I wanted to own. ;)

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Toner – do you have this coin in hand or are you using the picture from EBAY ??

If it’s the latter I would think the Ebay picture does not even come close to portraying what the coin really looks like.

 

+1

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I swear on my kid's lives that i never saw the coin on eBay or anywhere else.

 

It was really simple really. The coin has no visible wear (MS), very little contact marks, and a weak strike, which tells me 64. If it had a stronger strike, i'd say 65.

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Coins that deserve an MS64 grade and a CAC sticker... unlike the original coin.

 

I swear on my kid's lives that i never saw the coin on eBay or anywhere else.

 

It was really simple really. The coin has no visible wear (MS), very little contact marks, and a weak strike, which tells me 64. If it had a stronger strike, i'd say 65.

 

C'mon - even the ex-NGC grader didnt go as high as a 64. If you really didnt see it on EBay you should probably apply to be a grader somewhere then. You could certainly work for PCGS and CAC. lol.

 

Well done if you're serious - you beat us all !!!

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Of course not - not even close. Furthermore, Michael, I don't understand why you'd ask that, when I had compared their sight-seen opinion to opinions based just upon images. :devil:

 

I understand the position you're in. But anyone reading this thread, except for the most hardcore Kool-Aid drinkers and Green Lemonade aficionados, would still doubt if PCGS and CAC didnt make a mistake on this one. And I know you arent in either one of those camps.

 

Can you at least say its not a top end 64 ? Or do you think the strike can be this weak and still be considered a A coin ?

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I will take the sight-seen opinion of NGC, CAC or PCGS over image-based grade guesses, just about any time. That said, it doesn't mean I will necessarily like the coin.

 

You're not saying that PCGS and CAC are infallible though are you ?

 

Of course not - not even close. Furthermore, Michael, I don't understand why you'd ask that, when I had compared their sight-seen opinion to opinions based just upon images. :devil:

 

And crumby images at that...

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XF45 with a shot at AU50.

 

This by commercial standards if the luster is all there.

 

And crumby images at that...

 

Interesting... you didnt complain about the images when you guessed the grade.

 

Why all of the sudden the reversal ?

 

 

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Of course not - not even close. Furthermore, Michael, I don't understand why you'd ask that, when I had compared their sight-seen opinion to opinions based just upon images. :devil:

 

I understand the position you're in. But anyone reading this thread, except for the most hardcore Kool-Aid drinkers and Green Lemonade aficionados, would still doubt if PCGS and CAC didnt make a mistake on this one. And I know you arent in either one of those camps.

 

Can you at least say its not a top end 64 ? Or do you think the strike can be this weak and still be considered a A coin ?

 

Based on the IMAGES, the coin looks unattractive and over-gradeed. However, I would want to see it in-hand before judging it. To me, the strike, alone, would not preclude it from being an A coin, if it had everything else going for it.

 

I have seen so many coins whose images made them look shockingly better or worse than they appeared in-hand. Sometimes, it's hard to believe.

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This thread has gotten silly. The photos are so horrible it's ridiculous to make any comments about whether or not it's graded correctly. To me, the moral of this story is "sometimes coins look worse in bad photos than they did to the graders who saw them in-hand, under perfect light, with a loupe."

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Thanks, Mark.

 

Based on those images, I would have guessed (unattractive) 63 or 64 instead of (unattractive) 53-63. ;)

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I happen to like the look of this coin, particularly, the obverse. Has nice, even, light toning, with almost a crusty look in the crevices that shows its originality. It's also relatively mark free, except for that sole reed mark in the obverse field on the left. Unfortunately, it is a weak strike, and the reverse is a little blotchy.

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Nice catch on the photos. It looks MS now but it still doesnt look like a MS64 coin that deserves a Green Bean though.

 

 

 

 

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If the CAC sticker indicates agreement with the assigned grade, then it is justified. However, overall, the coin is sub-par in detail and worth much less than a well-struck piece in the same technical condition.

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This coin sold for $764 on Heritage.

 

Since Nov 2013, eight PCGS MS64 CAC 1921 Peace dollars have been sold at an average value of $844.50. One example sold for less and six sold for more.

 

..... sounds about right to me.

 

The photo on Heritage isn't fantastic, but there's no question it's of a lustrous coin with relatively clean surfaces. That can't be said of the photo in the OP.

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"This coin sold for $764 on Heritage."

 

I would pay that much for a fully struck AU 1921 Peace dollar.

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I would too, especially if "fully" means the same thing it does in other series.. They're virtually nonexistent though in any grade. I've seen a few that are pretty close.

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