would you give this coin a second look if at a coin show or in an auction?

[michael]

ngc ms67 1937-d buffalo nickel a really nice for the grade 67 coin

 

mark free obverse with only a slight nick well hidden above the buffaloes shoulder on the reverse

 

the toning is great! and fully prooflike surfaces booming out underneath the thick skinned toned surfaces

 

sincerely michael

[EVillageProwler]

The coin is pretty, but I wouldn't give a ``hoot'' for it because I'd want one that is better struck. I know that it's a D-mint specimen, but it's a latter date one (and they should come better struck).

 

EVP

 

[Hoot]

Thanks EVP for the cyber-hootenanny! And I'd agree, the strike is of a lesser coin, especially for a 37-D. I would not pay 67 price for that coin, especially since an MS67 37-D is an uncommon beastie. Perhaps I'd pay slightly more than your upper-average 66 price. That said, I paid 3x the MS66 price for my 1937-S, as it is such a looker - stunning (to use an over-used word). So, something more than a 66? Yes. 67 money? Nuts.

 

Hoot

[Gunsmoke]

Hoot and EVP, help me out here. I haven't refined my buf grading skills so please point out the weakness in strike area(s). Thanks.

[PQSeated]

Gunsmoke, if it helps you out any, I just usually look at the hair detail. Check out a picture of a fully struck one sometime and notice the difference in hair detail.

[MarkFeld]

EVP and Hoot,

 

Excuse me - you guys are looking at an exquisitely toned example like that and talking about the strike being less than full/perfect? Would you rather have a fully struck, ho-hum white one?

 

Michael, I wouldn't give the coin a second look because I would take one look and keep looking and then buy it !

[Trime-migration]

Michael,

I think the coin is great but I appreciate the responses even better because they point out the subjective subtleties of coin collecting. Coins are judged on a number of attributes and there are differences in weight placed by different collectors. There are toners and strikers and lusterers and die-staters, etc. It is like beauty and art- in the eyes of the beholder.

[Hoot]

Trime hits the nail on the head.

 

Mark - yup. In my personal opinion, I'm not going to pay stupid money for a coin if the fullness of the characteristics do not support the grade, market grading or not. Like I said, I paid three times the normal price for an exquisite 1937-S MS66! Stupid money. But the coin was well struck and absolutely dripping with lustre. The lustre slayed me (still does). Just shy of a 67, but it could as easily be in a 67 holder as the coin that Michael is showing, just based on a different character of appearance. Still, the strike was way better. An MS67 37-D is going to cost a person a grand. An MS66 will go for around a C note or less. I'd pay well for a monster toned 66 - maybe even up to $500 - stupid money. But that would be knowing that I was buying a 66, not a 67 (with the acceptance of any potential of loss).

 

The coin in question is weakly struck in the central devices, especially at the transverse hair lines in the Indian's hair knot. The obverse is also unevenly struck with the weak edge at the tip of the long feather. The reverse is far worse, an MS64 strike at best. There is significant detail lacking in the cape of the bison and on the hair surrounding the horn. The detail on the rear hip of the bison is poorly defined and the overall flatness is unappealing. By calling this coin an MS67, we are essentially saying it's worth $1000. I don't think so, but someone else may (or may have more money to throw away than I do).

 

The toning is unreal!!! I will take toned coins any day! (Note I still have an MS63 1935 in my registry set!) But I will only allow myself to get a little nuts, and not make (yet one more) stupid mistake.

 

Hoot

[MarkFeld]

Hoot,

 

I guess Trime did nail it - thanks for the explanation.

[Gunsmoke]

Based on what I have read on this forum and on my personal observations, there seems to be a great deal of variation between buffalo nickels of the same grade. Do you think this is an accurate observation?

 

If so, does this variance exist to the same degree with other coins or is it somewhat unique to bufs?

[Weidel Legacy Collection]

Hoot -

Thanks for the education! Your appraisal of the strike characteristics on both sides is very illuminating and much appreciated. I haven't ventured into Buffalos yet so you're comments are well noted.

[Hoot]

RWW - Don't venture into buff collecting - it's a bad, bad series with nothing interesting!

 

Gunsmoke - There is a great deal of variation in the quality of coins in every grade of every series. Buffs are no exception. This is innate to the market grading system. Pure technical grading can be qualitatively worse, however, since the premise holds that every coin ejected from a coin press is MS70; the trip from there adds negative traits that bring the coin down in grade. (Just imagine the potential for strike variability in that). So, although the market grading system is more subjective, it offers a grader the latitude to adjust the grade of a coin based on traits that are technically difficult to quantify. Thus, we will always have great variability of appeal, technical and market appeal combined, in every series.

 

Just my thoughts, Hoot

[EVillageProwler]

I'm late in signing on today, and Hoot seems to have responded quite nicely to the various inquisitive comments.

 

Let me add something...

 

When I embark on a series, I look to build a truly distinctive set. The distinctiveness should be a characteristic that is special to that series.

 

Like, with Seated Dollars, original UNC specimens with eye appeal. They are tough as all heck.

 

For Buffs, I like 'em to be well struck. That is the key attribute for this series. Toning is nice and all, but it's something that can be added afterwards with patience. Not so with design detail. It's there or it's not.

 

When I was chasing Walkers, I once spent an entire day (it was a small-ish show) looking for the best struck 1941-S. The grade was secondary, as long as it was at least ChMS. I found one that finally satisfied me, shortly before the closing. I bought it raw, and it still is raw and sitting on my bookshelf in a Dansco album.

 

EVP